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Old 06-03-2013, 01:37 AM   #76
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irregardless
Lochte is making you dumber.
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Old 06-03-2013, 08:12 AM   #77
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Lochte is making you dumber.

That plus fatigue and vodka.
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Old 06-03-2013, 08:35 AM   #78
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That plus fatigue and vodka.
I prefer mixing mine with redbull or cranberry
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Old 06-03-2013, 10:46 AM   #79
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Lochte is making you dumber.
lol Jeah I tried to watch an episode of his E! show and I think I lost any brains I have left. He's a brain vampire.
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Old 06-03-2013, 09:42 PM   #80
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With respect to the second, I think plenty has been written to discount it. As I said to you before, if you were to lower my household taxes by a significant amount, we'd be left with savings in the tens of thousands of dollars. What economic growth do you think it will promote if we were to get to keep an extra $50K or $100K of our income? Unlike the poor or middle classes who would likely funnel a lot of the extra savings into the economy through consumption (bigger house, new tv, new car, etc), we would rely on more advanced financial planning which would be aimed at (i) maximizing returns and (ii) minimizing taxes (remember, tax avoidance is not tax evasion and you can simplify the tax code but until and unless you agree to do away with the capital gains taxes which it's my understanding the GOP is dead set against).



There was a video by Matt Damon a couple of years ago where he also put it pretty bluntly - when he and his friends were making off like bandits, not a single one of them created a job in the economy or expanded a business. It was all invested into paper money, asset-backed securities, derivatives, etc. Not exactly what you are envisioning would help keep the economy chugging or improve the lives of the middle class in the heartland.
Two points I'd make:

One. Capitalism 101 or even a viewing of It's A Wonderful Life illustrates that unless you stuff your money in a pillow or buy gold for your Doomsday shelter, money put into stocks, bonds, savings and such is used for capital investments throughout the economy. So we need rich people to put money at risk in capital ventures.

Two. What business is it of anyone what Matt Damon does with his money if his talent has legally given him such a salary? I'd rather the ultra rich do what they wish with their assets than mandate that it be taxed to the government for anything but what constitutionally the government should be doing. If he wants to pay more taxes fine. If he wants to donate it all to his favorite cause, fine. But let Matt Damon do with Matt Damon's private property as he sees fit. I'd rather that Charlie Sheen blow his cash on cocaine and hookers than see him give it to the government to pay for studies on the sex lives of shrimp, food stamps and welfare for Chechen bombers, champagne baths for GSA employees in Las Vegas. bridges to nowhere or any of the other hundreds of billions of dollars wasted by the federal government.

Best wishes FYM, I'm signing off for the summer. See you in the fall*.

* Unless the Supreme Court acts unconstitutionally in regards to you know what.
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Old 06-03-2013, 10:14 PM   #81
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Two. What business is it of anyone what Matt Damon does with his money if his talent has legally given him such a salary?
Nobody is suggesting that we stick our noses into how people choose to spend their money.

But it is highly disingenuous of the GOP to be walking around suggesting that if taxes are raised on these individuals, it will kill jobs they are creating, or alternately, if taxes are lowered, these individuals will become job makers. The reality just does not bear out that way.
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Old 06-27-2013, 04:59 PM   #82
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Well surprise, surprise! I'm shocked - shocked by recent news in this "scandal."

http://maddowblog.msnbc.com/_news/20...d-scandal?lite

The short of it is this: the IRS targeted both conservative and progressive groups for scrutiny (as it should). However, the Inspector General in this lovely investigation was instructed, by Republicans, to only include scrutiny of conservative groups in his report. In his testimony (under oath, lest we forget), when directly asked whether any progressive groups were targeted, he perjured himself and said only the groups in his report (ie conservative) were.

So there you have it, folks. Republicans so desperate to pin a scandal on Obama that they simply make one up, deliberately mislead the public and lie about it under oath.

Classy.
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Old 06-27-2013, 11:17 PM   #83
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That's crap.

1) On May 10th the IRS admitted targeting conservative groups.

IRS admits to improperly targeting conservative groups - Los Angeles Times

Quote:
WASHINGTON – The Internal Revenue Service improperly screened applications from conservative groups that sought tax-exempt status, a senior IRS official said Friday.

IRS staffers selected for more review the applications that included the words “tea party” or “patriot,” Lois Lerner, director of exempt organizations, said in a conference call with reporters.
From Lois "plead the 5th' Lerner herself no less. Steven Miller admitted to the targeting under oath.

2) Only conservative groups have been complaining to congress, talk radio and other media for years prior to the May 10th admission. Only conservatives brought suit against the IRS and the Inspector General.

3) Where were the progressive or OWS Congressional witnesses to such abuses? Democrats were given the chance to bring them forward.

There's more reasons but they would require too much explanation to a audience that obviously could care less about this issue.

MSNBC, nice source for news.
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Old 06-27-2013, 11:38 PM   #84
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I care about the issue. I just have been (and still am) waiting for more facts to come out.

Of course, I have no partisan axe to grind either.
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Old 06-28-2013, 12:37 AM   #85
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That's crap.

1) On May 10th the IRS admitted targeting conservative groups.

IRS admits to improperly targeting conservative groups - Los Angeles Times



From Lois "plead the 5th' Lerner herself no less. Steven Miller admitted to the targeting under oath.

2) Only conservative groups have been complaining to congress, talk radio and other media for years prior to the May 10th admission. Only conservatives brought suit against the IRS and the Inspector General.

3) Where were the progressive or OWS Congressional witnesses to such abuses? Democrats were given the chance to bring them forward.

There's more reasons but they would require too much explanation to a audience that obviously could care less about this issue.

MSNBC, nice source for news.
Disclaimer: I am concerned about this issue, but still haven't seen enough real evidence to make a decision.

BUT, I think it's absolutely hilarious that you're calling people out on sources and how only one side complained. Maybe it tells you that some aren't as quick to play victim
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Old 06-28-2013, 03:40 PM   #86
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To be fair, dismissing information based on source is somewhat ingrained in process here.

Maddow was not the only one reporting the story this way, but it does show how a new source operates as a partisian advocate.

We start with the initial audit request from Issa: "Has the IRS targeted conservative "tea party" groups?"

Maddow and others re-write this as an audit request from Issa: "Has the IRS targeted groups - please only report on conservative "tea party" groups and disregard anything considered liberal or progressive."

Maddow then bases her story on the reformulated factual analysis to result and produce a sensational headline.

I was interested to see Diemen's post because I had just seen a news article on Reddit's front page addressing the "tea party" vs "progressive" scrutiny.

The article describes how key words representing both sides of the political spectrum appeared on the BOLO lists; but in practice, the conservative "tea party" groups were scrutinized at a far higher rate.
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Old 06-28-2013, 03:46 PM   #87
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This is one of those things that needs to be investigated, in depth, because even if half of the allegations prove to be substantially true, it is very troubling.

The issue I take with it is the insidious attempt to tie this like an albatross around Obama's neck when there has been not one iota of evidence connecting him to the scandal.
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Old 06-28-2013, 03:58 PM   #88
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The article describes how key words representing both sides of the political spectrum appeared on the BOLO lists; but in practice, the conservative "tea party" groups were scrutinized at a far higher rate.
I don't find this hard to believe. But I would have to wonder if the "tea party" groups were not only more numerous but a lot more transparently political.

The bottom line is, whatever kind of 'scandal' this is, it's incomplete.
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Old 06-28-2013, 04:08 PM   #89
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We start with the initial audit request from Issa: "Has the IRS targeted conservative "tea party" groups?"

Maddow and others re-write this as an audit request from Issa: "Has the IRS targeted groups - please only report on conservative "tea party" groups and disregard anything considered liberal or progressive."


is it really a rewrite? from The Hill:

Quote:
IG: Audit of IRS actions limited to Tea Party groups at GOP request
By Bernie Becker - 06/25/13 08:11 PM ET

The Treasury inspector general (IG) whose report helped drive the IRS targeting controversy says it limited its examination to conservative groups because of a request from House Republicans.

A spokesman for Russell George, Treasury’s inspector general for tax administration, said they were asked by House Oversight Chairman Darrell Issa (R-Calif.) “to narrowly focus on Tea Party organizations.”

The inspector general’s audit found that groups seeking tax-exempt status with “Tea Party” and “patriots” in their name did receive extra attention from the IRS, with some facing years of delay and inappropriate questions from the agency.

But top congressional Democrats have wielded new information from the IRS this week that liberal groups were also flagged for extra attention on the sorts of “be on the lookout” lists (BOLOs) that also tripped up conservative groups.

The spokesman for the Treasury inspector general noted their audit acknowledged there were other watch lists. But the spokesman added: "We did not review the use, disposition, purpose or content of the other BOLOs. That was outside the scope of our audit.”

The admission from the inspector general comes as Democrats have sharpened their criticism of George, with Rep. Sandy Levin (D-Mich.) dubbing the audit fundamentally flawed on Monday.

Levin, the top Democrat on the tax-writing House Ways and Means Committee, stressed to The Hill on Tuesday that the inspector general did not say the audit was limited to Tea Party groups when it was released in mid-May.

The Michigan Democrat also maintained that the audit’s shortcoming had emboldened Republicans to try to link the targeting of Tea Party groups to the White House.

“You need to get at the facts. And those facts weren’t given to us, even when asked,” Levin said. “The Republicans used the failure of the IG to spell out what they knew as an opportunity to totally politicize this.”

Levin’s office first disclosed on Monday that the term “progressive” was also included in the lists until this year and urged the Ways and Means Committee Chairman Dave Camp (R-Mich.) to bring George back for more testimony.
And while the inspector general’s office has not said they knew about BOLOs flagging liberal groups, Ways and Means Democrats said Monday that progressive organizations were among the almost 300 groups the inspector general examined for his audit.

Rep. Gerry Connolly (D-Va.), who questioned George about whether liberal groups were singled out at an Oversight hearing last month, also said Tuesday that it appears the inspector general's answers "were at best incomplete, if not misleading."

Camp and other Republicans have insisted that the evidence so far points to conservative groups receiving more scrutiny from the IRS, even if organizations across the political spectrum were on BOLOs.

Republicans at the House Oversight panel, for instance, have noted that the watch lists specifically said that Tea Party applications should be sent to Washington for examination, while the progressive entry does not.
GOP lawmakers have lobbed their own criticism at George, with Issa noting that the inspector general allowed Holly Paz, an IRS official at the center of the controversy, to sit in on interviews.

“It’s one thing to say we listed them all down,” said Rep. Jim Jordan (Ohio), a senior Republican on the Oversight panel. “To me, it’s still the exact same fact. They targeted conservative groups. Some groups still haven’t had any resolution to their application for tax-exempt status.”


Read more: IG: Audit of IRS actions limited to Tea Party groups at GOP request - The Hill's On The Money
Follow us: @thehill on Twitter | TheHill on Facebook
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Old 06-28-2013, 08:48 PM   #90
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IRS Investigator: Tea Party Groups Were Scrutinized More Than Progressive Organizations

Quote:
IRS Investigator: Tea Party Groups Were Scrutinized More Than Progressive Organizations
Posted: 06/27/2013

"Based on the information you flagged regarding the existence of a 'Progressives' entry on BOLO lists, TIGTA performed additional research which determined that six tax-exempt applications filed between May 2010 and May 2012 having the words 'progress' or 'progressive' in their names were included in the 298 cases the IRS identified as potential political cases," George wrote in his letter to Levin, the ranking member on the House Ways and Means Committee, who had asked why the initial audit didn't mention the screening of progressive groups.

"We also determined that 14 tax-exempt applications filed between May 2010 and May 2012 using the words 'progress' or 'progressive' in their names were not referred for added scrutiny as potential political cases," George continued. "In total, 30 percent of the organizations we identified with the words 'progress' or 'progressive' in their names were processed as potential political cases. In comparison, our audit found that 100 percent of the tax-exempt applications with Tea Party, Patriots, or 9/12 in their names were processed as potential political cases during the timeframe of our audit."
It's not close by the numbers, by the delays in processing or in the level of scrutiny. Not even remotely close.
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