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Old 06-23-2014, 07:35 PM   #61
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Fish.

Then I'd probably go with the salmon. Now in your truly bizarre hypothetical would the Dick be sitting at my table?
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Old 06-23-2014, 08:03 PM   #62
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Just never mind, it's not worth it. Someone said he's the most hated person on FYM, I find that incredible. That was it. It then went from there, as it tends to do in this forum. I really have nothing else to say on the topic, I've agreed with everything that's been said, wasn't looking for an argument.



Because I realized I was being hyperbolic, but it didn't appear to have much to do with your post.

So it is abundantly clear to everyone: Dick Chaney is a horrible, horrible man. One of the worst things to happen to this country's government and to political relationships the world over.



Keep in mind, Deep said that. We all take him with maximum irony.

Of course, like, Assad is worse, but as democratically elected Western leaders go, he's about as bad as anyone I can think of.
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Old 06-23-2014, 08:43 PM   #63
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I didn't even notice it was Deep. I'm really feeling sick today, fwiw.
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Old 06-23-2014, 10:23 PM   #64
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Then I'd probably go with the salmon. Now in your truly bizarre hypothetical would the Dick be sitting at my table?
Well, if the two of you are on a date I guess he would be! But no, he is at a table across the room sitting with his wife and daughter. What does your "anger" make you do in this situation?
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Old 06-23-2014, 10:28 PM   #65
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Which daughter?


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Old 06-23-2014, 10:55 PM   #66
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I don't want to get too over-the-top here, but I think Dick Cheney is a real jerk.
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Old 06-23-2014, 11:17 PM   #67
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Old 06-23-2014, 11:52 PM   #68
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Reported.
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Old 06-24-2014, 12:40 AM   #69
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I reserve my anger for Donald Rumsfeld. A four year old child could have executed the invasion with a better result. His bumbling incompetence and lack of any real knowledge of warfare cost American and Iraqi lives and doomed any (slim) chance of a successful Iraq. If we went in full force (and fully equipped), we would have stood a much better chance locking the country down and preventing the power and security vacuum that led to eight years of sectarian violence. We didn't even have half as many troops that were really needed, and the sad fact is that the generals knew that, but their requests for more fell on deaf ears with Rumsfeld. And what pisses me off just as much is that even when shit began to fall apart, instead of listening to military commanders, recognizing the problem, and adapting to it, we (and by we I mean Rumsfeld) just let Iraq continue to go to hell until it was an inch away from complete anarchy before deciding to change strategy.

And of course statements like, "You go to war with the army you have... not the army you wish you had..." *End veteran rant*
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Old 06-24-2014, 03:23 AM   #70
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Dick Cheney should be sent in to help sort out the trouble in Iraq. Alone, on foot, with full kit.
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Old 06-24-2014, 06:45 AM   #71
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Well, if the two of you are on a date I guess he would be! But no, he is at a table across the room sitting with his wife and daughter. What does your "anger" make you do in this situation?

My "anger" doesn't make me do anything. Unlike your hypothetical, most of us are reasonable in here.
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Old 06-24-2014, 06:54 AM   #72
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Yeah. Seriously, what the fuck.

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Old 06-24-2014, 08:12 AM   #73
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I reserve my anger for Donald Rumsfeld. A four year old child could have executed the invasion with a better result. His bumbling incompetence and lack of any real knowledge of warfare cost American and Iraqi lives and doomed any (slim) chance of a successful Iraq. If we went in full force (and fully equipped), we would have stood a much better chance locking the country down and preventing the power and security vacuum that led to eight years of sectarian violence. We didn't even have half as many troops that were really needed, and the sad fact is that the generals knew that, but their requests for more fell on deaf ears with Rumsfeld. And what pisses me off just as much is that even when shit began to fall apart, instead of listening to military commanders, recognizing the problem, and adapting to it, we (and by we I mean Rumsfeld) just let Iraq continue to go to hell until it was an inch away from complete anarchy before deciding to change strategy.

And of course statements like, "You go to war with the army you have... not the army you wish you had..." *End veteran rant*
Forgive my ignorance of the nuances of US Cabinet politics, but is logistics the Secretary of Defence's responsibility? In Canada it's the Department of Finance who is responsible for funding all military budgets.

Rumsfeld was a shithead too. The Bush administration truly was a gang of thieves and scum. Evil? I wouldn't go that far but they certainly were pragmatic to a fault.
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Old 06-24-2014, 08:55 AM   #74
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Interesting thought experiment: what would have happened in 2011 onward if the US had never invaded Iraq?

My instinct is to say that the Arab Spring would have occurred in Iraq similarly to how it occurred in Syria. There would have been mass semi-pro-democracy protests against Saddam, the secular-ish Arab nationalist dictator, they probably would have struggled and eventually led to violence, and radical groups like ISIS would have filled power vacuums just like in Syria.

Another scenario: what if the Obama Administration had kept a substantial presence on the ground in Iraq? ISIS certainly would have had a much harder time. But it's a fairly undesirable proposition to keep US troops on the ground in the Middle East forever to hold off radical Islamic groups, and it would probably breed more radical-fueling anti-colonial hatred of the US in the process.


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Old 06-24-2014, 10:06 AM   #75
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If Dick Cheney was in the same restaurant as me I'd probably make some jokes about it on Twitter.
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