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Old 06-24-2009, 07:30 PM   #661
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Abortion on demand advocates may find it interesting to consider a case where a black woman has a child by a white man - or vice versa - and the woman decides to abort the child, as, on mature consideration, they decided they didn't want to bring up a mixed race kid. Perhaps the woman discusses the matter with her parents, friends, whatever, and is told that she will not be accepted in her community if she raises a child of a different skin colour. So, a racist reason for abortion. A hypothetical case, granted, but it is not difficult to imagine such a scenario. Racists should surely be strong advocates of abortion, at least in this scenario. But, good liberal folk have the right view on both abortion and race, so obviously there's a disconnect here somewhere.

Rgds,

FG (exposing liberal hypocrisy on the web since 2007)

Are there wrong reasons to abort? Of course.

There are wrong reasons for everything.

Ultimate fail.

Not even a decent try.
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Old 06-24-2009, 07:35 PM   #662
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Just to clarify both your points of view on this. Assuming it is possible to assess likely future IQ from a scan of the womb, it's ok to abort a baby purely does he/she does not meet the parent's required IQ standards?
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Old 06-24-2009, 07:52 PM   #663
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Just to clarify both your points of view on this. Assuming it is possible to assess likely future IQ from a scan of the womb, it's ok to abort a baby purely does he/she does not meet the parent's required IQ standards?
Would Republicans start supporting abortion if they knew their children would grow up to be liberal?
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Old 06-24-2009, 07:57 PM   #664
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Would Republicans start supporting abortion if they knew their children would grow up to be liberal?
Well, indeed - you've (probably unintentionally) hit on a scenario that suits my case perfectly. Some neocon Republicans are supporters of abortion-on-demand. So, you're right - that scenario you've outlined could well happen, if science advanced so far that a scan could predict likely future political preference. It's a mistake to think this is sci-fi. We already know that political preference is something that one is borne with, to a large extent.

Of course, you've skirted around addressing the core issue.
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Old 06-24-2009, 08:16 PM   #665
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We already know that political preference is something that one is borne with, to a large extent.
Really? Do tell.


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Of course, you've skirted around addressing the core issue.
Because the "core issue" is completely ridiculous. You're basically going down the genetic engineering route type of argument.

The problem is your assumption. You ASSUME people support choice based on certain scenarios. I don't. We can't place restrictions because how would you do so? You can't prove rape in all scenarios, you can't prove if it's for racism views, etc... So if you believe abortion is ok in scenarios of rape then you have to support choice, there's no way around it. Are you going to make women prove it in court, tie them up for months and then if she's found to be in deed raped have a late term abortion?

To me you are for choice or you are hard line there is no scenario under the sun. That's pretty much it, the rest is just debating hypotheticals.

So instead of focusing on these failures of imaginitive gotcha moments, let's focus on trying to reduce the reasons women do get abortions. If both sides would work together we could have done a lot more, rather than wasting time on thinking you've exposed some hypocrisy...
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Old 06-24-2009, 09:10 PM   #666
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Just to clarify both your points of view on this. Assuming it is possible to assess likely future IQ from a scan of the womb, it's ok to abort a baby purely does he/she does not meet the parent's required IQ standards?
I personally do not believe it's okay to do so, no.

BUT.

If if you pass the legislation that says women may not abort in that scenario, then it's a slippery slope to saying women can't abort for reasons x, y and z.

I don't have the answer.
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Old 06-25-2009, 10:44 AM   #667
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--

Quote:
Top Ten Advertisers Targeted to Pull Advertising from CBS and Letterman


--

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
1. Southwest Airlines has STOPPED advertising
2. Embassy Suites has STOPPED advertsing
3. Hellman's has STOPPED advertising
4. Olive Garden NO LONGER advertising but MAY RESUME
5. Johnson & Johnson STILL sdvertising
6. Kellogg's STILL advertising
7. Verizon STILL advertising
8. Sears STILL advertising
9. All-State STILL advertising
10. Macy's STILL advertising
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Old 06-25-2009, 11:02 AM   #668
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Source?
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Old 06-25-2009, 11:08 AM   #669
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I saw a report that Olive Garden had pulled their advertising, and then the next day saw a report that Olive Garden said that wasn't true - they didn't have any more ads scheduled, but they hadn't pulled it.

So I wouldn't bet the farm on your shiny list there, bub.
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Old 06-25-2009, 11:08 AM   #670
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the abortion issue should not be up to the federal government. period.

to me, abortion is one of those non-issues that gets people to argue and fight and distracts them from what is REALLY going on behind the curtains. same with all this gay-marriage nonsense. another issue that the fed has no business with.
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Old 06-25-2009, 11:22 AM   #671
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I saw a report that Olive Garden had pulled their advertising, and then the next day saw a report that Olive Garden said that wasn't true - they didn't have any more ads scheduled, but they hadn't pulled it.

So I wouldn't bet the farm on your shiny list there, bub.
Yeah, more than likely that list came from an email or some other batshit crazy website just to make the folks feel like they are not alone in their batshit craziness...
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Old 06-25-2009, 12:27 PM   #672
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Why don't you tell us how easy it is to get.
If I was a pregnant woman in my first or second trimester I could drive 40 miles from here to an abortion clinic, which performs 40 abortions a week, and get an abortion.
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Old 06-25-2009, 12:30 PM   #673
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politico.com

June 25, 2009

Palin blasts Alaska blogger over Trig photo

Sarah Palin is again responding forcefully to a perceived attack on one of her children, this time attacking an Alaska blogger who edited a picture of her and her baby son, Trig, to replace Trig's face with the image of a conservative Alaska talk show host, Eddie Burke.

Emails Palin's spokesman Meghan Stapleton:

Recently we learned of a malicious desecration of a photo of the Governor and baby Trig that has become an iconic representation of a mother's love for a special needs child.

The mere idea of someone doctoring the photo of a special needs baby is appalling. To learn that two Alaskans did it is absolutely sickening. Linda Kellen Biegel, the official Democrat Party blogger for Alaska, should be ashamed of herself and the Democratic National Committee should be ashamed for promoting this website and encouraging this atrocious behavior.

Babies and children are off limits. It is past time to restore decency in politics and real tolerance for all Americans. The Obama Administration sets the moral compass for its party. We ask that special needs children be loved, respected and accepted and that this type of degeneracy be condemned.


The blogger, Linda Kellen Biegel, responded that she was making fun of Burke, a talker on KBYR who is a fervent Palin backer, not of Trig.

"It's called 'Baby Burke' because it's Eddie Burke...basically his probable second-biggest fantasy about the Governor," Biegel wrote. "So, connecting the dots for you...WE'RE MAKING FUN OF EDDIE BURKE!!!!!!"
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Old 06-25-2009, 12:47 PM   #674
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If I was a pregnant woman in my first or second trimester I could drive 40 miles from here to an abortion clinic, which performs 40 abortions a week, and get an abortion.
Do you know if you can have it done on your first visit? Some states have informed consent laws that (I believe) require a second trip to the clinic, as their first visit requires they receive information and then they have to wait before the procedure.

This might mean a second trip to the clinic, and for those who don't live within close range of a clinic, paid for with money they might not have, and maybe having to miss another day of work, which might mean losing their job.

Understand that it's not that "easy" for many women. Check out the ways it can vary from state to state, what restrictive measures are in place.

http://www.prochoiceamerica.org/choi...tate-profiles/
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Old 06-25-2009, 02:13 PM   #675
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If I was a pregnant woman in my first or second trimester I could drive 40 miles from here to an abortion clinic, which performs 40 abortions a week, and get an abortion.
Are there protesters blocking the entrance with photos? Will people threaten you as you walk into the clinic? Are there bombs placed at the clinic, endangering the lives of the health care professionals who work there?

Is there a "waiting period"? Do you have to prove that you have been raped or will die if you complete the pregnancy? Do you have to ask permission from complete strangers?

Or do you live in a state which respects the private health decisions of women? If so, lucky you, because that respect for privacy and health care applies to the men in your state as well.

eta: Go Cori!
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