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Old 12-23-2008, 05:27 PM   #16
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Seppuku?
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Old 12-24-2008, 01:04 AM   #17
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I haven't had time to follow this story too closely, as I've been traveling for most of the last 2 weeks (though to say di Shande, 'The Disgrace', was the talk of the Jewish community in my hometown, where we were staying, would be an understatement). What can you say about something like this? It's as mystifying as it is despicable. Even if one can somewhat understand the greed (or should I say, the compulsion? could it be that?), how and why someone who'd already enjoyed such success in life could so elaborately lie to so many vulnerable people for so long, not to mention the risks to himself and everything he'd worked for his whole adult life...And the idea that he presented himself as this great Jewish philanthropist and friend to Jewish philanthropists, it's just stomach-turning.

A few years back, there was a lawyer in a nearby town out here who wound up in prison for something vaguely similar--as I recall, he'd gotten into skimming money off trust funds he'd won for clients, and inevitably reached a point where he didn't have enough money coming in to cover up for it. He, too, was an older guy with a long and (by local terms) extremely successful career--best-known practice in the area, very wealthy and all that--so when the story broke, everyone was shocked: What could possibly have motivated him to take such stupid risks, to make a mockery of everything his practice was supposed to be about by exploiting the very people it was his job to help? Granted, this was nothing compared to the scope of Madoff's scheme, and at least the money this lawyer's clients were waiting for actually (had) existed, but it's the only situation I'm personally familiar with that I can think to compare it to.

I just don't get it...
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Old 12-24-2008, 12:59 PM   #18
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Quote:
Originally Posted by financeguy View Post
Stuff like this makes it so much harder for people like me to defend the capitalist system.
Remember my psychological argument will apply to psychos who work for the government. We have the 20th century to see what they can do with the socialist powers given to them. (Stalin, Mao, Hitler, Pol Pot to name a few). The answer is punishment in the court system. The court system has to punish people harshly for their transgressions. We live in a world where punishment is less harsh and people get out of jail over and over again repeating crimes. If people feel they don't have to worry about tough jail sentences then criminals will feel that their crime pays. Society has gotten very lax on prison sentencing since 1960 and it's no surprise that people are cynical now and feel they can get away with anything.

Most economists that were any good wrote moral philosophy books at the same time because no system will work without the majority of the population believing in justice and fair play and exacting that justice unflinchingly on perpetrators. I think this idea of programming immoral people into morality leads to the elimination of punishment and it's no surprise that people like this:



and this:

YouTube - The Dark Knight Interrogation High DVD Quality

...drive us to the wall. Psychos, NPD, Egomania people don't think like us.

If the justice system doesn't take criminals seriously why should criminals take the justice system seriously?
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Old 12-24-2008, 06:13 PM   #19
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Your dichotomy is flawed, our morality is plastic.
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Old 12-25-2008, 10:38 AM   #20
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Your dichotomy is flawed, our morality is plastic.
Slogans? Please.

What's your idea of a good justice system?
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Old 12-30-2008, 12:01 AM   #21
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It seems that the Madoff funds collapse isn't necessarily related to the overall economic enviroment: an expert who investigated the fund sussed it as a fraud but expected it to collapse several years before it actually did:-

Madoff_SECdocs_20081217 - Business and madoff fraud hedge fund
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Old 01-13-2009, 11:34 AM   #22
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I hope things aren't getting too tough for him in that penthouse, I'm really starting to worry
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Old 03-04-2009, 11:01 PM   #23
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Madoff's World | vanityfair.com
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Old 03-05-2009, 12:44 PM   #24
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Poor guy, all holed up in his penthouse.
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Old 06-29-2009, 12:12 PM   #25
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Looks like he Madoff with 150 years in prison.

Quote:
EW YORK, June 29 (Reuters) - U.S. District Court Judge Denny Chin sentenced disgraced financier Bernard Madoff, 71, to 150 years in prison on Monday for perpetrating Wall Street's biggest and most brazen investment fraud.

Cheers and applause came from the courtroom as Madoff stood facing the judge with his hands clasped in front of him.
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Old 06-29-2009, 12:29 PM   #26
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hope he gets big gay bubba as a cellmate
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Old 06-29-2009, 12:59 PM   #27
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Greed is not good?

I wish he could live 150 more years so he'd have to serve that much time. I just hope he doesn't go to some country club prison.
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Old 06-30-2009, 07:59 PM   #28
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I occasionally think that the US criminal justice system is too severe with regard to 'white collar' crime.

This is not one of those occasions.
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Old 07-01-2009, 08:03 PM   #29
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Seriously

this guy did not pull this off by himself

there has got to be several other high up people that knew these numbers were a sham
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Old 07-01-2009, 08:39 PM   #30
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that's a lot to read

I am still trying to finish The Black Swan

I'm about 55% through.
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