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Old 09-02-2014, 03:15 PM   #16
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Here's the thing. Even if you don't believe that human activity is causing climate change, why would you not support initiatives to clean up the environment? What is bad about trying to keep our planet clean and healthy for future generations?

Like most things - this has to do with money. Until solar is cheaper than fossil fuel - big business will fight environmental regulations and the data that supports it because it cuts into their profits.
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Old 09-02-2014, 04:47 PM   #17
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One can believe in God and still want strong environmental controls.

Also - as I've said before - solar power will cure almost all of the planet's ills in the next few decades...

Grid parity: Why electric utilities should struggle to sleep at night - The Washington Post
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Here's the thing. Even if you don't believe that human activity is causing climate change, why would you not support initiatives to clean up the environment? What is bad about trying to keep our planet clean and healthy for future generations?
This and this.

I can't, for the life of me, understand why people argue so strongly against global warming. Real or not (definitely real, just btw), what in the hell is the harm in finding an alternative means of fueling our world? There's only so much fossil fuel...we've known that most of our lives. No drilling in Antarctica is going to make more appear. Once it's gone, it's gone...it's better to find an answer now than to continue to jump on the idea that somehow, someway, us being the cause of harm to this planet is some form of insanity.

It's not just fuel, I know that. That's just my personal hot button issue. People hate being blamed for things, it's natural not to want to be at fault. But honestly, this is something that feels so petulant whenever I see someone post a thread or article like this. As others have already said and the point I'm trying to make: IT CAN'T HURT to try and fix things. Please show me who the victims are, to do otherwise.
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Old 09-02-2014, 05:11 PM   #18
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This and this.

I can't, for the life of me, understand why people argue so strongly against global warming. Real or not (definitely real, just btw), what in the hell is the harm in finding an alternative means of fueling our world?


because objection to global warming isn't about science. it's about sociocultural identity and not wanting to be told what to do.
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Old 09-02-2014, 05:42 PM   #19
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Even if you don't care about keeping our planet clean and healthy, at the very least we should care about the geopolitical instabilities that oil has caused. Time to send the Middle East to irrelevance.
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Old 09-02-2014, 07:33 PM   #20
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It's always hilarious when somebody posts an article "proving" something, and the article is written by a foreign journalist in a foreign paper that they know nothing about. Years ago we used to have the dreck of Mark Steyn copied and pasted here by people who were not Canadian and not familiar with his writings and stances. Then every once in a while you have somebody linking to the likes of the Daily Mail or some similar rag.
For these reasons I almost always try and do a background check on these journalists before or after I read the articles.
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Old 09-03-2014, 07:47 AM   #21
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What is it that skeptics of global warming are so quickly labeled to be against the environment?

I agree we should do all we can to insure in clean water and air.

I agree we should seek alternative fuels and power sources.

I agree in protecting and conserving natural resources.

My family recycles our trash. We try to avoid plastics and prefer buying selected products in glass containers. We grow many of the vegetables we eat. We turn our waste from the kitchen into compost for the garden.


What I refuse to do is jump on a propaganda wagon that, although extremely popular to jump on and ride wave the green flags, is based on some very questionable science.



One concern is how this issue has effected children. Most of my students in middle school put global warming at the top of their list of fears and concern.

BrainPop is a tool that is used in my school district.

This is what they found:

NEW YORK, April 20 /PRNewswire/ -- While recent polls show that
American adults are most concerned about the war in Iraq, terrorism, and
healthcare, a survey of more than 1,000 middle school students across the
country found that kids fear global warming more than any of these issues.
The survey was conducted by BrainPOP, a New York based educational
provider.

Some of the most intriguing findings from the BrainPOP global warming
survey include:

-- Nearly 60 percent of children said they feared global warming and
environmental disasters-such as hurricanes, tornados and flooding-more
than terrorism, car crashes, and even cancer (22.3 percent feared
terrorism most; 14.6 percent cancer; 5.9 percent car crashes).

-- Nearly one-third of children reported thinking about global warming a
lot and worrying about how the effects of global warming will change
the planet and directly impact their lives. Another 41.2 percent think
about it sometimes and say that they are somewhat worried.

-- Roughly 60 percent of children surveyed believe that more needs to be
done in their community to help the planet and stop global warming.

-- When asked what effect of global warming worries them the most, the
majority of kids surveyed are most afraid of the toll it will take on
the lives of people.
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Old 09-03-2014, 07:56 AM   #22
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Global Warming Revisited

You don't believe your sources to be part of a propaganda wagon? Honestly?


Your stance seems to be one purely of defiance, not one that has looked at facts and made their decision. That's an extremely dangerous position to hold.

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Old 09-03-2014, 08:06 AM   #23
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One concern is how this issue has effected children. Most of my students in middle school put global warming at the top of their list of fears and concern.
You want them to worry more about terrorists and Iraq?

I think it makes perfect sense for children to worry more about the potential affects of global warming.


(I'm not even taking into consideration how framing the BrainPop survey differently would have ended in different results.)
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Old 09-03-2014, 08:49 AM   #24
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Why motivate through a fear of something we haven't fully defined yet? Why not teach environmental responsibility?


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Old 09-03-2014, 08:54 AM   #25
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What I refuse to do is jump on a propaganda wagon that, although extremely popular to jump on and ride wave the green flags, is based on some very questionable science.
Have you EVER read a peer-reviewed scientific journal?
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Old 09-03-2014, 09:05 AM   #26
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The only people who "question" the science are those with interests in furthering the bottom line of the fossile fuel industy.

But that's how it works, and how "doubt" and "question" and "controversy" are created when there actually isn't much of any if that in reality.


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Old 09-03-2014, 09:09 AM   #27
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Not always, unless you're talking on a public scale, irv.


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Old 09-03-2014, 09:39 AM   #28
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Why motivate through a fear of something we haven't fully defined yet? Why not teach environmental responsibility?


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Should we wait and fully define terrorists threats before doing anything about them?

Just take an hour today and listen to Fox News, they will tell you that ISIS attack on NY, Canadian border, and the Mexican border are imminent, but say let's wait until we know EVERYTHING about climate change before doing anything.

Fear motivates, not saying it's right or wrong but everyone does it.




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Old 09-03-2014, 10:26 AM   #29
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Not always, unless you're talking on a public scale, irv.


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on this issue, yes, always.
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Old 09-03-2014, 10:29 AM   #30
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Just take an hour today and listen to Fox News, they will tell you that ISIS attack on NY, Canadian border, and the Mexican border are imminent,

it really is amazing how Fox manages to be anti-Mexican, anti-Muslim, anti-Obama, and pro-war all in the space of a single talking point. my favorite is when they speculate that Obama seems to hate America so much that he actually wants a terrorist attack to occur on our soil to punish us for all the bad things we've done in the world, but then someone brings up the fact that a terrorist attack might be bad for his approval ratings, so maybe he doesn't actually *want* a terrorist attack, though they're certain he'd make America apologize to the terrorists if one were to happen. and amnesty.
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