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Old 07-23-2010, 09:16 PM   #376
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Originally Posted by maycocksean View Post
No joke.
Seems like you too are as uneducated as I am.
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Old 07-23-2010, 09:23 PM   #377
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Originally Posted by INDY500 View Post
You'll get no defending of Japanese-Americans getting their rights taken away. And I consider Japan today to be one of our best trading partners. But America's anti-Japanese prejudice in the 40's was no shame, in fact, it was not only warranted but vital.

Just a reminder. Japan attacked the United States and declared war on us. They were a formidable foe and an imperialistic country with a cult of personality leader in Emperor Hirohito. (Kamikaze pilots were the 1st suicide bombers.) American along with Allied and Chinese POWs were brutally treated and abused. Real war crimes, atrocities and torture (unlike the politically puffed-up charges against GWB). Japan made no secret of its intentions to ignore the Geneva Conventions. Hundreds of thousands of prisoners were forced to work in prison camps. Between dysentery and the working conditions almost 20,000 Allied POWs died building the Death Railway in Burma.
Gee, thanks for the history lesson, prof. Should we have also set up internment camps for German-Americans?

The only way your (appalling) statement would work is if citizens who emigrated to another country were a monolithic group that functioned as agents for their homeland's government. And since that's obviously untrue and too absurd to even consider, I'm left in shock that you could make such a bigotted statement with a straight face.

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Even Bugs Bunny was ready to kill "Nips" and "Japs."
Seriously?

Seriously??
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Old 07-23-2010, 09:23 PM   #378
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Originally Posted by maycocksean View Post
There were no German-American internment camps, though Nazi Germany was also an enemy of the United States and also responsible for horrific atrocities and inhumanities.
"There were no German-American internment camps."

That is surely not correct?
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Old 07-23-2010, 11:05 PM   #379
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Originally Posted by PhilsFan View Post
Your post only talked about Imperialist Japan. The injustice of the 40s was the treatment of Japanese-Americans and Japanese immigrants in America.


this pretty much says it all.

having met and interviewed Japanese-Americans who lived in internment camps, i won't even dignify INDY's post with a response.

but i will say that it should serve as an example of the beating, bleeding racist heart of right wing America.
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Old 07-23-2010, 11:14 PM   #380
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"There were no German-American internment camps."

That is surely not correct?
Yes, it is correct. The US government did not round up German Americans and take them to camps "for their own safety" like they did with Japanese Americans.
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Old 07-23-2010, 11:25 PM   #381
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I was going to respond to INDY, but I decided he really wasn't worth it. If a person like him showed up at my house and started talking his racist, homophobic bullshit, I'd throw him out and he'd never step foot in my house again, so that's what's going to happen here. He's done, he's over, he's gone as far as I'm concerned. I don't use the ignore list, but I can still ignore. It's a waste of my time to deal with him on any level, so I'm not.
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Old 07-23-2010, 11:29 PM   #382
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I honestly think Indy is mixing up the Japanese army with Japanese-Americans, so I'm willing to wait for a clarification before I say more than my original reply.
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Old 07-24-2010, 12:38 AM   #383
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Originally Posted by corianderstem View Post
Yes, it is correct. The US government did not round up German Americans and take them to camps "for their own safety" like they did with Japanese Americans.


white Americans are real Americans.

Sarah Palin has taught us this.
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Old 07-24-2010, 12:42 AM   #384
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I honestly think Indy is mixing up the Japanese army with Japanese-Americans, so I'm willing to wait for a clarification before I say more than my original reply.


keep in mind, the conservative American tends to see all non-whites as indistinguishable from one another. and they are convinced that the election of a black man is somehow bad for white people, because that's what "they" do when "they" get into positions of power -- seek reparations. because the real racists are black people. this is what Andrew Breitbart is telling us.

but i hope you are right. we weren't arguing over the atomic bomb, we were talking about rounding up american citizens and forcibly removing them form their homes and putting them in camps.

and if anyone thinks it had anything to do with anything other than race, please, take a look at Hawaii. many more Japanese-Americans, yet none of them wound up in camps. why? they needed them to pick pineapples and sugarcane. so, yeah, big security threat there. big. huge.

Native Sons of the Golden West - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
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Old 07-24-2010, 03:25 PM   #385
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Quote:
Originally Posted by INDY500 View Post
You'll get no defending of Japanese-Americans getting their rights taken away. And I consider Japan today to be one of our best trading partners. But America's anti-Japanese prejudice in the 40's was no shame, in fact, it was not only warranted but vital.
Quote:
Originally Posted by INDY500 View Post
You didn't even bother to read the whole post did you?

Just more hate from a conservative right?

I have to wonder about what type of garbage you've been taught about the United States and WWII. And if you're under a certain age I wouldn't actually blame you for some beliefs you may have.
FUCKING DISGUSTING!!!

True colors...
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Old 07-24-2010, 10:17 PM   #386
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Racism is a useful tool, apparently.

If only the Tea Party brought that same vigour to political rallies, oh wait.
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Old 07-25-2010, 05:53 PM   #387
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Originally Posted by Irvine511 View Post
white Americans are real Americans.

Sarah Palin has taught us this.
She's wrong.
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Old 07-25-2010, 09:31 PM   #388
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Fun stuff watching y'all play "I can be more outraged than that" while not bothering to read my post.

Quote:
FUCKING DISGUSTING!!!
Looks like BVS is the winner just edging out Martha.

In the "why bother" Dept but for the record. We were talking about America in the 40's. Or so I thought.

Glenn Beck:
Quote:
"I can't imagine that in 1948, they would have had 'Japanese Day' at the water park on December 8th."
Don't know why he choose Dec 8th but Maycocksean's response makes absolutely no sense in any case.

Quote:
what seems to be lost on Beck is that the anti-Japanese prejudice is one of the great shames of World War II.

I'm surprised he isn't advocating internment camps.
Notice "anti-Japanese prejudice." No mention of Japanese-Americans. In fact Japanese-American wouldn't be mentioned until Philly posted AFTER my posts.
Quote:
Your post only talked about Imperialist Japan. The injustice of the 40s was the treatment of Japanese-Americans and Japanese immigrants in America.
Yes, it was an injustice and more about that later, but it has NOTHING to do with what Glenn Beck said. But at least someone actually read my post. Thank you Philly.

SO what was I doing? What I've consistently done, defend conservatives and defend American history. Glenn Beck is right, America was not in any mood to celebrate anything Japanese in 1948. Just the opposite, with VJ Day still being a big celebration in the late 40's.

Now what is so controversial about me defending Beck and 'the Greatest generation" by saying:
Quote:
And you'll see that there is no shame for dropping atomic bombs on Japan or showing
anti-Imperialist-Japan (later edited by me to the less clunky) anti-Empire of Japan prejudice.
Are you people so stuck in the politically correct 2010 that you must look down your nose on Americans of the 40's who in one Dec morning became the pissed off sleeping giant?
Quote:
America's anti-Japanese prejudice in the 40's was no shame, in fact, it was not only warranted but vital.
Is this Dieman's "bigotted statement"?

Not to a nation at war against a country with the human rights record of Imperial Japan. We were right to hate that Japan and wish to pound it into complete submission. Dieman might not like that there was once a time we were concerned only with winning once we went to war. That appeasing the enemy has not always been a priority. And I know Dieman doesn't like that even Hollywood supported the cause in WWII; hence the outpouring of pro-American war films along with "anti-Japanese" themes in radio programs, films and yes, the 1944 WB cartoon 'Bugs Bunny Nips the Nips.'

Now, have I in the past on this board or would I now use terms like "nips" or "Japs" in any dealing? No, they are offensive terms. One of the reasons the "Greatest Generation" is just that is after the war in Europe and after the war in the Pacific, they came home. And the process of rebuilding those countries, including Japan, began. By the time of the next generation, mine the Baby Boomers. We were watching Godzilla movies on TV and listening to Cheap Trick at Budokan. And today Toyota is in NASCAR.

So what about
Quote:
I consider Japan today to be one of our best trading partners
do you NOT understand? They are an ally and a friend.

Finally. As internment camps are mentioned I said this:
Quote:
You'll get no defending of Japanese-Americans getting their rights taken away
Did everyone completely fail to read this? Really, how do you miss that? IT's the FIRST LINE OF MY POST. Just as I said, there is NO defense of Americans having their constitution rights stripped for no reason than they are of Japanese heritage. Again NONE. And I offered none!! But it is more a stain on the legacy of FDR than a "shame" of WWII that must be borne by all Americans. And it has absolutely nothing to do with why Americans were not going to be having "Japanese Day" at water parks in 1948.

So, where is "the beating, bleeding racist heart of right wing America" in my post that Irvine sees? (Of course Irvine sees "the beating, bleeding racist heart of right wing America" in everything not liberal group-think.)

What exactly is the "racist, homophobic bullshit," as martha so elegantly puts it only she can?

"FUCKING DISGUSTING!!!" Really?

When actual debate and discussion broke out, I've enjoyed being a member here. But that's increasingly rare. And I don't enjoy racial and religious tensions being heaped upon the political polarization that already exists. I'm sorry, I've tried to keep this fun but it just ceased to be.

Sayonara,
Willie
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Old 07-25-2010, 10:34 PM   #389
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Quote:
Originally Posted by INDY500 View Post
Fun stuff watching y'all play "I can be more outraged than that" while not bothering to read my post.

Looks like BVS is the winner just edging out Martha.

In the "why bother" Dept but for the record. We were talking about America in the 40's. Or so I thought.

Glenn Beck:

Don't know why he choose Dec 8th but Maycocksean's response makes absolutely no sense in any case.



Notice "anti-Japanese prejudice." No mention of Japanese-Americans. In fact Japanese-American wouldn't be mentioned until Philly posted AFTER my posts.


Yes, it was an injustice and more about that later, but it has NOTHING to do with what Glenn Beck said. But at least someone actually read my post. Thank you Philly.

SO what was I doing? What I've consistently done, defend conservatives and defend American history. Glenn Beck is right, America was not in any mood to celebrate anything Japanese in 1948. Just the opposite, with VJ Day still being a big celebration in the late 40's.

Now what is so controversial about me defending Beck and 'the Greatest generation" by saying:


Are you people so stuck in the politically correct 2010 that you must look down your nose on Americans of the 40's who in one Dec morning became the pissed off sleeping giant?

Is this Dieman's "bigotted statement"?

Not to a nation at war against a country with the human rights record of Imperial Japan. We were right to hate that Japan and wish to pound it into complete submission. Dieman might not like that there was once a time we were concerned only with winning once we went to war. That appeasing the enemy has not always been a priority. And I know Dieman doesn't like that even Hollywood supported the cause in WWII; hence the outpouring of pro-American war films along with "anti-Japanese" themes in radio programs, films and yes, the 1944 WB cartoon 'Bugs Bunny Nips the Nips.'

Now, have I in the past on this board or would I now use terms like "nips" or "Japs" in any dealing? No, they are offensive terms. One of the reasons the "Greatest Generation" is just that is after the war in Europe and after the war in the Pacific, they came home. And the process of rebuilding those countries, including Japan, began. By the time of the next generation, mine the Baby Boomers. We were watching Godzilla movies on TV and listening to Cheap Trick at Budokan. And today Toyota is in NASCAR.

So what about do you NOT understand? They are an ally and a friend.

Finally. As internment camps are mentioned I said this:


Did everyone completely fail to read this? Really, how do you miss that? IT's the FIRST LINE OF MY POST. Just as I said, there is NO defense of Americans having their constitution rights stripped for no reason than they are of Japanese heritage. Again NONE. And I offered none!! But it is more a stain on the legacy of FDR than a "shame" of WWII that must be borne by all Americans. And it has absolutely nothing to do with why Americans were not going to be having "Japanese Day" at water parks in 1948.

So, where is "the beating, bleeding racist heart of right wing America" in my post that Irvine sees? (Of course Irvine sees "the beating, bleeding racist heart of right wing America" in everything not liberal group-think.)

What exactly is the "racist, homophobic bullshit," as martha so elegantly puts it only she can?

"FUCKING DISGUSTING!!!" Really?

When actual debate and discussion broke out, I've enjoyed being a member here. But that's increasingly rare. And I don't enjoy racial and religious tensions being heaped upon the political polarization that already exists. I'm sorry, I've tried to keep this fun but it just ceased to be.

Sayonara,
Willie
Willie,

Perhaps you deserved some more thoughtful replies than some of what you received. I know it's not fun to get piled on, even more so when you are in the minority. But I do stand by my reply both to Glenn Beck's ideas and your post. I feel it was reasonable and not attacking.

I don't know if you're still around to read this--but at any rate, let me clarify. Glenn Beck's argument about Japanese Day in 1948 IS flawed. The Muslim Day at Six Flags is for Muslims it's not celebrate the achievements or ideology of Al-Queda. The assumption that all Muslims in general should be lumped in with the Muslim extremists is unjust, in the same way that saying that Japanese people couldn't gather at a water park on December 8, 1948 by virtue of their race. It's like telling Japanese-AMERICANS that they need to go hide in a closet for x number of years after WW II. It's a lumping in of people in America with other people in another country who happen to share the same ethncity (or religion). That is racism. And Glenn Beck seemed to feel that was okay, given the times.

As for your post, you are correct that I missed your first sentence that you were not about to defend the constitutional rights of Japanese Americans being stripped. Nonetheless, the rest of your post, perhaps inadvertantly, basically contradicted your initial statement. As I understand your post in the context of the discussion we were having,you were arguing that prejudice against Japanese during and immediately after World War II was justified--"warranted and vital" I believe was the wording--because the nation of Japan was our enemy. Despite your disclaimer in the beginnning it seemed clear that you were referring to Japanese people IN THE UNITED STATES. After all, Becks complaint was about Muslims IN THE UNITED STATES, not about Muslims in Pakistan or Afghanistan or Saudia Arabia. Or maybe you were trying to paint me in to a corner and suggest that I was saying that determination to defeat Japan in wartime is tantamount to racism. Of course it is not.

I had no quarrel with anything you had to say about opposing Imperialist Japan. I did have a problem with what appeared to be an argument that prejudice against Japanese people is okay because we are at war.

Having reread both of your recent posts a few times, I think I understand what you were trying to say. . .and it's just flat out wrong, not to mention unfair. Just because I think that being against a Japanese Day in 1948 is racist does NOT mean that I feel the U.S. needed to apologize for defending itself against Japan's aggression and taking measures to soundly defeat Japan. You got jumped on for once more creating a straw man and beating the crap out of it. In fact you continued to beat up in this straw man in your most recent post as you insisted that Diemen had a problem with American fighting Japan to win.

As for trying to keep this fun--you have had some funny moments, but I'll be frank with you. From you, as well as from people like Beck, Limbaugh, and Coulter, I've gotten a rather cynical vibe, that I find sad. You enjoy yanking the chains of liberals--yeah, I get that--but it comes at the cost of people in the conservative camp who actually take this stuff deadly serious. You say America is being destroyed by Obamacare etc etc, but you say it with a sneer. You don't engage in the serious kind of discussion that is merited if the nation is truly being taken apart as you suggest. Instead you crack one-liners and take potshots, and thus contribute to the polarization you claim to bemoan.

I hope I haven't just wasted my time in writing all this, but if I have. . .well, it wouldn't have been the first time.
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Old 07-25-2010, 10:47 PM   #390
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Quote:
Originally Posted by INDY500 View Post
But America's anti-Japanese prejudice in the 40's was no shame, in fact, it was not only warranted but vital.

Quote:
Originally Posted by INDY500 View Post
But America's anti-Japanese prejudice in the 40's was no shame, in fact, it was not only warranted but vital.



Quote:
Originally Posted by INDY500 View Post
But America's anti-Japanese prejudice in the 40's was no shame, in fact, it was not only warranted but vital.






Buh-bye.
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