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Old 11-08-2009, 03:25 PM   #76
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Do his actions require all of us to explain ourselves and apologize on behalf of our religion and country?

No one is asking him to do that.
We're asking that he be prosecuted and hopefully get the death penalty.

Many are going to "he was just insane argument" way way too quickly.

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Old 11-08-2009, 03:31 PM   #77
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Many are going to "he was just insane argument" way way too quickly.

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Old 11-08-2009, 03:35 PM   #78
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I think anyone who shoots up their workplace is "insane," but maybe that's just me.

whether they just snap, whether they plot it out for months, whether or not they have religious motivation/affiliations, it is not a "sane" act to kill 13 people. Doesn't matter if he's a Muslim who said "god is great" or a Catholic who said "Jesus, this one's for you, dude."

But I guess I'm just jumping to that conclusion too quickly.
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Old 11-08-2009, 04:23 PM   #79
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Well you would think that if he had a documented history of mental illness, that this is something which should have been monitored by his superiors, particularly in light of the fact that he was going to serve abroad shortly in a high-stress environment.

And I don't understand why considering this factor somehow diminishes the fact that he may also have been a religious nut. Isn't the best possible outcome in this bad situation at this point gathering all relevant information and going forward, using it to weed out others with similar predispositions?

It's like some people just want to neatly package it as "he's a crazy ass Muhammad-lover" which is fine and dandy, but isn't necessarily productive in getting the full picture.
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Old 11-08-2009, 04:47 PM   #80
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And I don't understand why considering this factor somehow diminishes the fact that he may also have been a religious nut. Isn't the best possible outcome in this bad situation at this point gathering all relevant information and going forward, using it to weed out others with similar predispositions?.
Predispositions based on mental illness or based on religious extremism?

I think I agree with your post...but just know if the U.S. military starts weeding out whacky people before they do something real bad, the PC folks are going to fly off the handle.
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Old 11-08-2009, 05:22 PM   #81
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Predispositions based on mental illness or based on religious extremism?
I would think both, and when you have a combination thereof, then that should be an even bigger red flag.
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Old 11-08-2009, 05:36 PM   #82
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Predispositions based on mental illness or based on religious extremism?

I think I agree with your post...but just know if the U.S. military starts weeding out whacky people before they do something real bad, the PC folks are going to fly off the handle.
is anyone really going to be opposed to less crazy people with guns? i'd hope not.
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Old 11-08-2009, 07:44 PM   #83
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I think I agree with your post...but just know if the U.S. military starts weeding out whacky people before they do something real bad, the PC folks are going to fly off the handle.


or would the churches complain that soldiers are having their religious freedoms trampled on?

in light of everything that's going on, do we really think that the best course of action here is to increase discrimination against Muslim soldiers?

on the broader points being brought up here, where we see vague resentment at what's lazily described as being "PC," we should stop and ask ourselves if white, christian, Gulf War veterans were subject to harassment and identified as "known enemies" after Oklahoma City?
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Old 11-08-2009, 08:30 PM   #84
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If there were a history of white, Christian, Gulf War Veterans continuously comitting attrocities, then yes, I would absolutely expect them to be profiled.

If gays were bombing town buildings because they could not get a marriage license I would expect them profiled.

I would have to see evidence that Muslim soldiers are or have been discriminated against. Again, if they are posting on blogs and publicly making statements that appear to be leaning towards extremism, then FUCK YES...monitor them and do not promote them.

I see no vague resentment? What does that mean. Fact is I rasied a valid concern, and I see it in the real world. People aill cry agism, sexism, racism and sue and raise hell when someone holds them accountable for their job performance, to the point that it does make it difficult for management to supervise. So yes, I think it a valid question, how did the major get to the point that he outranked 95% of the people in the military, when it took less than an hour for his blog posts, his outbursts at a security conference to be publicized, ect.... yet somehow he was promoted, even with poor evaluations.

There have been comments by people who are IN the military that say that this has impacted their experience in the military.

Of course, its easy to just pass it as some point that isn't really valid....In particular when it may actually have some merit.

Anitram, I agree with you, his stability should not be discounted. I question anyones stability who happens to be an extremist, no matter what their religion.
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Old 11-08-2009, 09:53 PM   #85
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Im not sure what the debate is here. Hmmm...
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Old 11-08-2009, 10:20 PM   #86
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It's about women being the new revelation. Duh.

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Old 11-08-2009, 10:25 PM   #87
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Start a new one.
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Old 11-08-2009, 11:22 PM   #88
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are there many American-born Muslim service members continually committing atrocities?

more, were there many American-born Muslims committing any atrocities?

shooting sprees in this country tend to be committed by straight white presumably christian males. same with serial killers.

at least straight white christian males are never, ever promoted beyond their capabilities because of affirmative action or quotas or liberal guilt.


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Old 11-08-2009, 11:36 PM   #89
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shooting sprees in this country tend to be committed by straight white presumably christian males. same with serial killers.


Exactly. Lee Boyd Malvo and Anthony Sowell come to mind.
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Old 11-08-2009, 11:50 PM   #90
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Exactly. Lee Boyd Malvo and Anthony Sowell come to mind.


what is it about the word "tend" don't you understand?
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