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Old 12-02-2008, 12:02 PM   #1
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First "War on Xmas" Thread - We have a winner !

Typical, out comes an anti-gay bigot to speak out on the REAL important issues.

"we're a Christian nation and ought to use the word."

Buttars takes aim at stores waging 'war on Christmas' - Salt Lake Tribune

Chris Buttars - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Deseret News | Anti-segregation ruling wrong, Buttars says

Anti-Gay, Racist, Pro-segregation, pretty typical really.

Utah must be hell.
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Old 12-02-2008, 12:05 PM   #2
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It took them till the 2nd? They're getting slow...

These people are really so clueless they aren't even a waste of my time.
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Old 12-02-2008, 12:13 PM   #3
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buttars is anti-gay? i thought he was just bi-confused.


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Old 12-02-2008, 12:18 PM   #4
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Heh. That's exactly what I thought of when I saw the link titles.
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Old 12-02-2008, 02:27 PM   #5
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Christian nation is obviously wrong. America is, like European countries, a secular state with a majority of its population being Christian.

Nevertheless, I find the substitution of Christmas with Season's Greetings and other generic terms quite ridiculous. I don't know of any non-Christian who takes offense at hearing the word Christmas in any context, nor one who honestly thinks any person would use that on purpose in order to offend or missionize him.
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Old 12-02-2008, 02:31 PM   #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Vincent Vega View Post
Christian nation is obviously wrong. America is, like European countries, a secular state with a majority of its population being Christian.

Nevertheless, I find the substitution of Christmas with Season's Greetings and other generic terms quite ridiculous. I don't know of any non-Christian who takes offense at hearing the word Christmas in any context, nor one who honestly thinks any person would use that on purpose in order to offend or missionize him.
As an atheist, I have no problem whatsoever with "Merry Christmas", I say it myself. I think "Happy Holidays" is a crock overly politically-correct, however I have a bigger issue with the bigots and politicians who spend their time worrying about this, have they nothing better to do ?
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Old 12-02-2008, 02:37 PM   #7
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I'm agnostic as well, but never cared for that term in any way. We also celebrate Christmas at home. It's just a nice holiday.
Trying to be politically correct sometimes tends to take extremes which are very ridiculous. And furthermore, I see it as a sign of tolerance to accept Merry Christmas, just like no one should worry about saying Happy Chanukah.

I don't particularly find it disturbing when politicians question this form of political correctness, but their reasoning, like displayed in this case, often is as weird and wrong.
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Old 12-02-2008, 02:59 PM   #8
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I don't know of any non-Christian who takes offense at hearing the word Christmas in any context, nor one who honestly thinks any person would use that on purpose in order to offend or missionize him.
I've known quite a few people who are offended by the mere mention of the word "Christmas", not to mention the songs and decorations. Why, I'll never know. I think its bigotry on their part. I mean, it doesn't bother me when I hear the word Chanukah or Ramadan, or any other religious holiday. I do think the holiday season should incorporate all the religious holidays so no one would feel left out, rather than banning or secularizing anything Christmas related.
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Old 12-02-2008, 03:09 PM   #9
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I would be interested in their reasoning for being offended.
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Old 12-02-2008, 03:16 PM   #10
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I can understand their wariness, because I've seen Christians prolythesize (sp?) during this time of year. But to be completely offended? I think that's taking wariness too far.
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Old 12-02-2008, 03:18 PM   #11
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I would be interested in their reasoning for being offended.
I used to work with a guy who insisted on working on Xmas day because he was Jewish and it wasn't "his" holiday - Told him he was an idiot, just take all the days off you get ! I'd gladly take one for Ramadan, Hanukkah, Canadian Thanksgiving, Buddha's birthday, whatever.

When I say "Merry Christmas" I mean it as "I hope you enjoy the day you get off work and use to exchange gifts with your family, and if you don't exchange gifts or celebrate it in any way, then I hope you still have an enjoyable day on that day". Merry Xmas is just a lot shorter !

You don't have to be American of European descent to enjoy Thanksgiving or say 'Happy Thanksgiving', you don't have to be an ex-union member to enjoy Labor day, and you certainly don't need to be a Christian to say/hear "Merry Xmas" without getting bent out of shape.
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Old 12-02-2008, 03:41 PM   #12
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I am put off by the culture warriors in general and I think this is one of the more laughable topics but the people who are so deeply offended at Christmas in non-State matters piss me off just as much.

I for one, have argued that Christians should steal back their religious holiday from the consumerists. It meant more to me as a religious holiday when I was a Christian. As it stands right now, our culture is pretty much 100% behind Christmas as a holiday for retailers as it is. How could anyone take the 'War on Christmas' seriously, when the people who champion it are just as bad as everyone else when it comes to sheer materialism.
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Old 12-02-2008, 03:52 PM   #13
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When people get annoyed by it, it's usually precisely because it's become politicized. I don't personally know any Jews, Muslims or what-have-you who go around snarking back at people who wish them "Merry Christmas;" on the other hand, in the course of working retail for a decade I did encounter the reverse a few times--people jumping down my throat for smiling and saying "Have a great holiday," which was my standard closer (with strangers).

If you don't want people frothing at the mouth because you said "Happy Holidays," then practice what you preach by not freaking out when they say "Merry Christmas"--likewise, if it ticks you off when people get snotty over "Merry Christmas," then put your money where your mouth is by graciously accepting "Happy Holidays" as the sincere expression of goodwill it's intended to be. It's when people get into the mindset that they 'deserve' to be feted with some particular phrasing, and that others--even complete strangers--somehow owe that to them, that you get problems.
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Old 12-02-2008, 03:52 PM   #14
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I for one, have argued that Christians should steal back their religious holiday from the consumerists. It meant more to me as a religious holiday when I was a Christian. As it stands right now, our culture is pretty much 100% behind Christmas as a holiday for retailers as it is. How could anyone take the 'War on Christmas' seriously, when the people who champion it are just as bad as everyone else when it comes to sheer materialism.
I agree
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Old 12-02-2008, 04:09 PM   #15
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Vincent Vega View Post
Nevertheless, I find the substitution of Christmas with Season's Greetings and other generic terms quite ridiculous. I don't know of any non-Christian who takes offense at hearing the word Christmas in any context, nor one who honestly thinks any person would use that on purpose in order to offend or missionize him.

I'm Christian and I don't find using Season's Greetings or Happy Holidays as ridiculous. There are other holidays being celebrated during that time as well, to me telling everyone that walks into the door of your store "Merry Christmas" is just arrogantly saying only my holiday counts. Those that I know are Christians I say Merry Christmas to, those that I don't know I say Happy Holidays, it just seems like common courtesy to me.

If nutjobs really wanted to fight the war on Christmas fight the commercialization of the holiday, not the fact that some are acknowleding that other holidays exist.

This is exactly why evengelicals look so ridiculous they fight the fights that won't effect them, they never fight the difficult ones. They defend marriage by picking on the minority instead of looking at the huge divorce rate within their own church. They defend Christmas by bitching about the decorations or what's said at a store greeting but ignore the fact that walking into a store to buy your child an iPod is not what Christmas is...
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