Did you watch O'Rieley last night

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diamond said:


context, making a point, showing the irony of it all.

There's no irony, though. William's comments weren't racist. O'Reilly's comments on the other hand, at best, showed regretable ignorance about the ability of black people to carry themselves in civilized manner. That's a type of racism in my book.

diamond said:

al sharpton and jesse jackson do not condemn gansta rap ( in fact they're more sympathic) .

Prove it. Give a me a quote that shows these guys supporting gangsta rap. Or does you saying it make it so?
 
Headache in a Suitcase said:
there is some truth to the idea that it's very hard for a white person to have a serious discusion about race relations without coming off sounding like a racist.


Not at all. There are plenty of white people right on this forum that have managed to discuss race relations without sounding like a racist.
 
diamond said:


Correct, especially objectifying them thru song, deeds, or actions- like Hilary's husband has done, who she has protected for polictical ambition , thereby enabling those who denegrate women to continue to do so.

But you'll ignore this fact, indirectly perpetuating the cycle to continue, and continue to post clips and articles supporting your causes, occassionally surprising some of us here and there w/a decently written and objective piece, but for the most part it's recycled tabloid fodder.

good job, bravo-

dbs

Thanks-coming from you that's a compliment. You wouldn't be able to recognize women truly being denigrated if it smacked you right in the face. And you are one of the least objective people here, if not the least objective. Hillary denigrates women in your eyes, but that's only because it fits with your political agenda. So it's ok for you to call her a shrew as well. Frankly I am so tired of your sexist remarks, and THOSE are offensive to me. As are your condescending holier than thou attacks on other people in this forum.

Some of the things you have said are so much more offensive than that avatar (they all are, but I say some so I won't be too broad) yet you chose to make an issue over that? And it wasn't personal either right, cause you just don't like someone pointing out your double standards? If it wasn't so sad it would be hilarious.
 
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diamond said:


both would be viewed as offensive, and some from your crowd would attempt to argue both as 'freedom of speech', but neither wouldn't stand as avatars-not in this fourm, according to the rules.

dbs

One's illegal in public, and one isn't. And as I said, it didn't break any rules, I did it as a favor to someone.

You acted like a child, and sometimes it's just easier to give into the child so congrats.

And what exactly is "my crowd"?
 
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NEW YORK (AP) - Fox News Channel's Bill O'Reilly said Wednesday his critics took remarks he made about a famed Harlem restaurant out of context and "fabricated a racial controversy where none exists."

He criticized the liberal group Media Matters for America as "smear merchants" for publicizing statements he made on his radio show last week.

O'Reilly told his radio audience that he dined with civil rights activist Al Sharpton at Sylvia's recently and "couldn't get over the fact that there was no difference" between the black-run restaurant and others in New York City.

It was just like a suburban Italian restaurant, he said. "There wasn't any kind of craziness at all," he said.

O'Reilly told The Associated Press that Media Matters had "cherry-picked" remarks out of a broader conversation about racial attitudes. He had told listeners that his grandmother - and many other white Americans - feared blacks because they didn't know any and were swayed by violent images in black culture.

"If you listened to the full hour, it was a criticism of racism on the part of white Americans who are ignorant of the fact that there is no difference between white and black anymore," he told the AP. "Circumstances may be different in their lives but we're all Americans. Anyone who would be offended by that conversation would have to be looking to be offended."

His radio show was a conversation with Fox News contributor Juan Williams, author of a book about the coarseness of some black culture. Williams defended O'Reilly during a Tuesday appearance on "The O'Reilly Factor."

"It's so frustrating," Williams said. "They want to shut you up. They want to shut up anybody who has an honest discussion about race."

Sharpton, appearing on O'Reilly's TV program Wednesday, acknowledged that he found accounts of what O'Reilly said "disturbing and surprising," but added that he had not heard the radio broadcast.

"You and I have gone to dinner before in Harlem, and I've never heard you say anything offensive," said Sharpton, speaking from Baton Rouge, La. "I'm going to listen to the tape and I'm going to give a judgment."

The controversy was similar to one that enveloped presidential candidate Joe Biden last winter. When Biden praised rival Barack Obama as "articulate" and "clean," many saw this as a way of conveying those were unusual characteristics for blacks.

Sylvia's manager Trenness Woods-Black told the New York Daily News that O'Reilly's remarks were "insulting" and showed he has little knowledge of the black community.

At one point on the radio show, Williams mentioned that too many people see little else in black culture beyond profane rap. "That's right," O'Reilly said. "There wasn't one person in Sylvia's who was screaming, 'M.F.-er, I want more iced tea.'"

Karl Frisch, spokesman for Media Matters, said it is typical for O'Reilly to criticize his group for merely reporting what he says.

"We didn't call him a racist," Frisch said. "We said his comments were ignorant and racially charged, and we stand by that."

O'Reilly said that the Williams conversation was carried on more than 400 radio stations and that there wasn't one complaint from a listener.

"This isn't about a racially insensitive remark," he said. "Anybody can listen to the unedited version of the conversation on Billoreilly.com. You want to think I'm insensitive to race, you go right ahead."

The real story, he said, was about the "corrupt media culture" in which outlets like CNN and MSNBC do stories about his remarks "because they're getting killed in the ratings."
 
Note to those who have to do damage control. When you claim something is out of context, try showing the context it was actually placed in. Don't just say it was out of context and then walk away.
 
And what about the context of all his other prior remarks that could be possibly interpreted as being racist? People don't make public commentary in a vacuum, and he must know that.

http://mediamatters.org/items/200709270005?f=h_top

"During the September 26 edition of MSNBC's Countdown with Keith Olbermann, discussing Fox News host Bill O'Reilly's controversial September 19 remarks about his visit to Sylvia's restaurant in Harlem, Washington Post columnist Eugene Robinson said of O'Reilly's comment: "t was, at best, a casually racist remark." Robinson also said: "[W]hat really ticks me off is that when you say that, when you point that out, you know, immediately you get charged by O'Reilly and cohorts with, you know, you're the thought police, you're the thought Gestapo, you're the word Nazis, you're interfering with free speech, and somehow cutting off an honest debate about race. Well, tell me what in the year 2007 is debatable about whether or not black people can use a knife and fork. I don't think that's debatable at this point."
 
Doesn't O'Reilly realize that every time he opens his mouth on this particular issue he just rams his foot in deeper? At this point he's up to his knee I think.

Does Bill not recognize the fact that he expected, I don't know what he expected, but that he assumed Sylvia's would be "different" than other establishments he's eaten in shows his bigotry & ignorance. I don't necessarily blame him for having those expectations, but they are bigoted. I don't see why he doesn't just admit it & move on.

It's not like his core audience would care.
 
I read this on gawker.com

Charts And Graphs
What Does Bill O'Reilly Really Say About Black People?

Fox News motormouth Bill O'Reilly is upset—he says that his recent remarks about those oh-so-well-behaved black people in Harlem were totally taken out of context! So we wondered: Well, what context were they in? Searching through the Fox transcripts, using the terms "Black, "African" and "African-American," and discarding comments about Africa (such as about Darfur or the IMF), Intern Mary itemizes the way in which Bill O'Reilly has talked about black people.

OREILLYFINAL.jpg


As a bonus, some of our favorite O'Reilly moments:

"Black Americans are understandably sensitive about any racial comment made by a Caucasian because of past history. It is true that the most vile things imaginable can be said about the white majority without any consequence, but America has a different set of rules for different groups." —10/4/05

"With single black women now heading 54.4% of all African-American households, the seeds of social chaos are deeply planted... Forget about counting on parents, that's a pipe dream. The truth is that many parents are addicted to the pipe or the bottle or to pursuing an irresponsible life. Even Bill Cosby can't force a screwed up mother or father to be responsible." —7/8/04

And of course: "Senator Barack Obama seems to be a nice guy; I won't say he's 'articulate,' because some African-Americans hear that word and take offense. In fact, I won't give the Senator any compliments other than the nice guy description, just to be on the safe side." —2/8/07
 
Now he's on Bruce's case. Wow he sure gives Bruce tremendous power and influence. He wants Bruce to come on The Factor and back up his statements on 60 Minutes-and he called Bruce a pinhead. I don't know why Kinky Friedman is talking about it, but O'Reilly says Bruce is afraid to come on the show.

25 grand to Habitat For Humanity if Bruce comes on the show, and "if he's a man" he'll do it.

http://www.foxnews.com/video2/playe...n the USA?&O'Reilly Factor&-1&Shows&362&&&exp
 
O'Reilly you are nothing but an entertainer, and you also don't ever answer questions in such forums, so what the hell are you talking about?
 
But O'Reilly doesn't see himself as an entertainer, apparently. He seems to see himself as some sort of intellectual giant/ arbiter of the truth whereas entertainers such as Bruce are unpatriotic pinheads. Hey Bush just said the US doesn't torture, so now Bruce is definitely lying :yes:
 
Bruce does have some flaws in his arguments, but a flaw in a liberal argument generally is equivalent to a crater in a conservative argument.
 
I would lose a lot of respect for Springsteen if he gave that lying bag of bile the time of day.
 
Just making this the all purpose O'Reilly is a fool thread. As for me I'd much rather have two guys kissing than mayo. Fewer fat grams and calories too :wink: AHA, spreading the GAY AGENDA with mayonnaise. I KNEW IT!!

Bill O'Reilly is not happy about a new UK ad for Heinz mayo that depicts two men kissing. The ad, which debuted earlier this week, runs with the tagline "Give your BLT a little NYC" and promises that the mayo is so good, it's like you have your own New York deli man in your kitchen.

Fox News host Bill O'Reilly spent some time on Friday's show crying out against the ad. His comments below:

"So why are they doing that? Why -- it was. It was obviously a gay thing. Now I don't know what the message is, other than gay people like mayonnaise. ... I'm confused. This whole gender blending thing. It's confusing to me. ... I just want mayonnaise. I don't want guys kissing. "

YouTube - O'Reilly: No Gays, Just Mayonnaise
 
What the hell does that mean, gender blending? I'm confused. Maybe it has to do with loofahs..



i think Bill is totally unaware that he's actually made an insightful comment -- or a comment that gives us insight into homophobia.

homophobia is, at it's root, sexism in disguise. what it does is threaten patriarchy, because it presents a reality where a man is "feminized" by a sex act, and it also eradicates the necessity of gender in a romantic relationship. homosexuality demonstrates the non-essentialism of traditional gender roles and reveals them to be social constructs predicated upon the perpetuation of patriarchy and when women get a whiff of this, then damn, we'll have anarchy on our hands.

of course, Bill was probably unaware that this is what he was really saying, but he did say it all the same.
 
homosexuality demonstrates the non-essentialism of traditional gender roles and reveals them to be social constructs predicated upon the perpetuation of patriarchy and when women get a whiff of this, then damn, we'll have anarchy on our hands.

I'm not sure that you've thought this one through.

If your argument above is correct, then it must logically follow that homosexuality is also a social construct predicated upon the perpetuation of - for want of a better word - 'gayness'. Which makes it a matter of choice.
 
I'm not sure that you've thought this one through.

If your argument above is correct, then it must logically follow that homosexuality is also a social construct predicated upon the perpetuation of - for want of a better word - 'gayness'. Which makes it a matter of choice.



i think you're making a leap.

sex = biology
gender = socialization

likewise, people are naturally born male or female, in the way that they are naturally born gay or straight. but they are socialized into roles based upon whatever biology they possess -- women = subordinate roles -- and these roles are reinforced by notions of essentialism that are designed to keep women in said subordinate role.

likewise,

sexual orientation = biology
sexual identity = socialization

thus, we have the phenomenon of what's known as "MSM" -- Men who have Sex with Men. often, at least in an American context, these are men from highly macho cultures who don't think of themselves as "gay" in any sense of the word, and the fact that they seek out male sexual partners is ignored in their social identity. i didn't choose to be homosexual, i did choose to "come out" and identify as a gay person. hence, you were born with a penis, you've chosen to play the role of male in society.
 
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