Couple Welcomes 17th Child, Wants More

[BVS]

Someone has a hard time actually reading people's posts. Your leaps in "logic" or assumptions are absurd.

Martha even goes out of her way to say "And I may be completely wrong for suspecting something's wrong, but sometimes".

And then you answer with: "So you're assuming all women..."

 

[martha]

So you're assuming all women who don't believe exactly as you do are being controlled by their husbands? That they must all think like you but they can't say it? Oh come on!

More conclusion-jumping. Don't your legs get tired? Go back and reread my post you quoted. Then quote where I said "all."

 

[anitram]

Can we list who is arguing which issue:

Mostly b and c, plus I think it's selfish in an overpopulated world to bring 17 first world children into it and I object to them whoring themselves out to the media as if they're some sort of beacon of parenthood.

 

[MrsSpringsteen]

Hey Brad and Angie are getting in the competition too....supposedly they want to have twins again and adopt again

ROGERS, Ark. – An Arkansas woman has given birth to her 18th child. Michelle Duggar delivered the baby girl by Caesarean section Thursday at Mercy Medical Center in Rogers. The baby, named Jordyn-Grace Makiya Duggar, weighed 7 pounds, 3 ounces and was 20 inches long.

"The ultimate Christmas gift from God," said Jim Bob Duggar, the father of the 18 children. "She's just absolutely beautiful, like her mom and her sisters."

The Duggars now have 10 sons and eight daughters.

Jim Bob Duggar said Michelle started having contractions Wednesday night. She needed the C-section, her third, because the baby was lying sideways. Jim Bob said both baby and mother were doing well Thursday night.

"We both would love to have more," he said.

 

[anitram]

Three c-sections - your body is trying to tell you something!

 

[snowbunny00774]

that thing will just hysterectomy itself soon out of fear.....

 

[redkat]

The c-sections might be to keep it from ejecting

 

[BAW]

Her pelvic floor must be the consistency of pudding by now

 

[Pearl]

"We both would love to have more," he said.

Why? Because kids are things to collect?

I know they say all of their children are blessings from God, but I wonder if they really see their kids are collection items rather than humans who need love and attention.

 

[Cin]

Her pelvic floor must be the consistency of pudding by now

diapers for her and the babies

 

[Liesje]

What bothers me about this family (well, besides the weird fundie religious angle) is that it seems the kids are basically raising the kids and running the home. To me there's a difference being a kid with some chores and responsibilities and maybe looking out for your baby bro because after all he's your baby bro, and being a kid whose basically a household slave. I feel like I spend more one-on-one time with my dogs than they spend with their kids.

 

[DreamOutLoud13]

You know, we had 4 kids in my family, with the possibility for more, but after two miscarriages in a row, my mom stopped trying.

I used to know a family that sort of did the quiverfull thing. Last time I saw them, which was several years ago, they already had about 7 kids, and probably a couple more by now. They were religious, but a fair bit more mainstream than the Duggars. The kids wore regular clothes and went to public school, and the older ones weren't forced to take care of the younger ones.

I think having lots of kids is fine (though anything more than 8 is really excessive) is fine, providing you can take care of them, and don't raise them like little robots.

It was mentioned earlier that if the mother had breastfed her kids for a natural, proper length (and believe me, I am all for breastfeeding. I myself was breastfed until 18 months), she would've been pregnant far less often. Breastfeeding is a natural form of birth control, because the body knows that if you're still nursing one baby, you don't need to be having more yet.

The fact is, they're not just letting nature take its course, by deliberately weaning the babies early, they're actively trying to have as many children as possible. This is what I find wrong. I personally believe in birth control and small families, but if someone chooses to forgo it and let what happens happen... that's fine. But I draw the line at deliberately making as many babies as possible and going so far as to alter natural behaviour in order to have more.

The reasons behind this are clear. First, they love the attention. They get money for it. People give them things and they get paid for TV specials. Second, Quiverfull. I've been involved with Evangelicals and the idea that good Christian families should have as many children as possible, in order to "further the Kingdom" and populate the country with good Christian conservatives is very real. I've heard it with my own ears. Hell, there's a billboard for a church in my city showing a couple with a baby and reading "Growing God's Kingdom, one family at a time."

This is not even to mention my disagreements with the way the children are being raised.

 

[kafrun]

What bothers me about this family (well, besides the weird fundie religious angle) is that it seems the kids are basically raising the kids and running the home. To me there's a difference being a kid with some chores and responsibilities and maybe looking out for your baby bro because after all he's your baby bro, and being a kid whose basically a household slave. I feel like I spend more one-on-one time with my dogs than they spend with their kids.

That's what I was thinking when I watched their show Sure, you can make it work, but why? Sure you can have as many kids as you want.. but what for?

 

[Liesje]

Or if you need a gazillion kids, then at least get some that actually need a home! To me that seems the Christian thing to do. I knew a girl who was one of 14, but 11 of her sibs were adopted from orphanages around the world. Their dad made a ton of money and they had an amazing house like a castle, definitely not the type of people that foster/adopt just for money from the government. Seriously I struggle with why I would even deserve to have ONE baby of my own making when there are already so many...

 

[kafrun]

Or if you need a gazillion kids, then at least get some that actually need a home!

Absolutely

 

[Liesje]

I'm watching them now and they are pissing me off. The kids keep making these really snotty comments about how "when other people" buy shoes and clothes they "go to the mall and buy REALLY EXPENSIVE stuff". Then they did this clip of them at the thrift store and I'm like fuck off kid! You don't know me or what I spend my money on... And then they made these really condescending comments about people who have debt...

 

[corianderstem]

Irreverent? Yes. Possibly offensive? A little. Kinda true? Totally.

 

[Liesje]

ha!

Now they are going to some museum that has life sized exhibits of....stuff in the Bible, lol.

I'm done folding the laundry so I don't have to watch anymore!

 

[U2isthebest]

ha!

Now they are going to some museum that has life sized exhibits of....stuff in the Bible, lol.

I'm done folding the laundry so I don't have to watch anymore!

Does it have the bones of the dinosaur that Jesus rode?

 

[Purplereign]

^

 

[dazzlingamy]

My only worry with this family is how sheltered the children are. Being home schooled, only spending time with each other and cousins and other religious people. It seems akin to total brainwashing. They have all ideas and opinions based on such a small part of the world they know, and now there are 18! of them which means 18 more families raising their own bucket load of children with skewed views of the world. I mean sure teach them to be loving and respectful and caring and responsible, but its the religous part that gets me worried. Are they total conservatives? Because having those morals out there with 18 kids is freaking scary.

Other then that, I'd love to have a big family. I've always wanted 7 kids. I don't think its going to happen, and 18 is insane but if they're raised with proper love and guidance, then good on them

 

[anitram]

In an episode I saw the other night, the mother was going on and on about the innate differences between boys and girls and how she isn't pressuring the girls to be housewives and let their husbands be the heads of the family and breadwinners, it's just that all her girls WANT that.

Now I can accept that there is a proportion of women who do want that. I have a good high school friend who got married as soon as she could (didn't finish her degree) and already has 3 kids with her husband and they're very happy. But you cannot tell me that all EIGHT of her girls want that and have absolutely no other aspiration in life whatsoever. That's just BS. Those kids have no idea about the world outside their front doors, and that's a real pity.

 

[Purplereign]

erm . . . why do they all have to be clones . . . :insertshuddersmiliehere:



(see cori's v v funny piccie above )

 

[MrsSpringsteen]

Now I really want/need to see that show

I never know when it's on. Maybe it's on On Demand

 

[anitram]

It's usually on Monday nights on TLC around 10 pm or so....but every once in a while TLC runs a marathon, like they did the other day.

 

[~BrightestStar~]

Or if you need a gazillion kids, then at least get some that actually need a home!

It took 9 pages of this thread before someone said what I'd been thinking all along. I'm not going to argue about how the kids are raised, what choices they make, or how many there are. But there are tons of kids in this world who would love to have a family, but don't have one. And more than that there are many older kids (preteens and teens) who will probably never get adopted because they aren't little and cute. If you have the space and the love, as these parents say, why not take in one of them - are they not god's children, a precious gift, too?
Or are the only precious children the one's that pop out of your vagina?

 

[indra]

It took 9 pages of this thread before someone said what I'd been thinking all along. I'm not going to argue about how the kids are raised, what choices they make, or how many there are. But there are tons of kids in this world who would love to have a family, but don't have one. And more than that there are many older kids (preteens and teens) who will probably never get adopted because they aren't little and cute. If you have the space and the love, as these parents say, why not take in one of them - are they not god's children, a precious gift, too?
Or are the only precious children the one's that pop out of your vagina?

To be fair though, you can ask the same of anyone having a child or children.

 

[VintagePunk]

To be fair though, you can ask the same of anyone having a child or children.

I agree, you can say the same of anyone. But I think it's especially relevant with very large families. I can understand the desire to give birth to your own flesh and blood, someone who is a related, will carry on your dna, etc, but once you get past 3 or 4 children, what's the point? You've already accomplished that. Especially in this day and age, where financial costs are insane, and birth control is readily available. Why not improve the lives of existing children?

I dunno. I stopped at one child (although at one point when she was younger, I expressed an interest in fostering, but my ex nixed that idea, and since I've been on my own, it just hasn't been practical). I guess I just can't relate at all to people like these. It seems incredibly selfish to me.

 

[~BrightestStar~]

To be fair though, you can ask the same of anyone having a child or children.

I agree.

And personally, I would very much consider it.

But however illogical or unfair it may be, something inside of me just bulks at the idea of you pumping out 17 children, and not *once* considering giving some other poor child a home.

I agree, you can say the same of anyone. But I think it's especially relevant with very large families. I can understand the desire to give birth to your own flesh and blood, someone who is a related, will carry on your dna, etc, but once you get past 3 or 4 children, what's the point? You've already accomplished that. Especially in this day and age, where financial costs are insane, and birth control is readily available. Why not improve the lives of existing children?

Again, pretty much what I was thinking. I understand the desire to have children who are related, but at some point - maybe I would go so far as to say it becomes selfish?

 

[yolland]

I think though that this "Quiverfull" ideology they're committed to specifically pertains to the couple being perpetually 'open' to their own fertility, not attempting to limit it artificially through contraception (and in their case, apparently going beyond that by weaning early, though I suppose it's possible that she has other reasons for not nursing longer). So at least in theory, it's not only a question of wanting a large number of children. I know that if for some reason we had a goal of adopting, say, 12 kids, we'd certainly also be using contraception, even if we did still want 1 or 2 biological kids, so as to avoid winding up with 25 kids total or so. But presumably for them it's also about 'honoring God's gift of fertility in marriage' which is not something we personally see as imperative.