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Old 04-30-2011, 11:43 PM   #31
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I don't think that the resistance to Ignatieff stems from an anti-intellectual movement. All the party leaders are academics after all. It's really as simple as not connecting with the people - not even really inspiring his base. In fact, I dare say that much of the NDP's recent popularity is grounded in disaffected "soft liberals."

The left side of the country is looking for someone with a strong voice, and Micheal's is not being heard. And his staff knows this, as evidenced by his recent "rise up" shtick (which is embarrassing, I think, as it smacks more of desperation and political maneuvering than true passion.)
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Old 05-01-2011, 11:54 AM   #32
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It does appear that Harper won't achieve his majority, and Layton is increasingly looking to become opposition leader. It will be very interesting to see what happens in the aftermath!
Both the conservatives and liberals will be reviewing their leadership options.

My riding is solidly conservative. There aren't even NDP, Green or independents running.
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Old 05-01-2011, 12:05 PM   #33
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I don't think that the resistance to Ignatieff stems from an anti-intellectual movement. All the party leaders are academics after all. It's really as simple as not connecting with the people - not even really inspiring his base. In fact, I dare say that much of the NDP's recent popularity is grounded in disaffected "soft liberals."

The left side of the country is looking for someone with a strong voice, and Micheal's is not being heard. And his staff knows this, as evidenced by his recent "rise up" shtick (which is embarrassing, I think, as it smacks more of desperation and political maneuvering than true passion.)

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Both the conservatives and liberals will be reviewing their leadership options.
I actually like Ignatieff (as well as the Liberal candidate in our riding) and would have no qualms about voting for them if I hadn't decided early on to let my leftist freak flag fly, and go NDP (I was 90% there before the election was called, and pushed the rest of the way after meeting our NDP candidate).

I was reading this article http://www.torontosun.com/2011/04/29...k-hes-the-mack this morning about his failure to connect with voters. The author says that in person, he's an engaging guy, but that it doesn't translate well to tv. I wonder if that's actually the case, or if Harper's 2 years of Ignatieff attack ads did the trick, but resulted in pushing potential Liberal voters toward Layton rather than to himself.

Thoughts?


eta - Oh my.

http://hilltimes.com/dailyupdate/vie...oll_05-01-2011

I still don't think the NDP will form the minority, I think that when all is said and done, many people will regress to the mean and vote the way they normally do, but still, this is the most exciting federal election in my memory.
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Old 05-01-2011, 01:46 PM   #34
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I was reading this article http://www.torontosun.com/2011/04/29...k-hes-the-mack this morning about his failure to connect with voters. The author says that in person, he's an engaging guy, but that it doesn't translate well to tv. I wonder if that's actually the case, or if Harper's 2 years of Ignatieff attack ads did the trick, but resulted in pushing potential Liberal voters toward Layton rather than to himself.

Thoughts?
I have met and spoken with Ignatieff and can attest that this is somewhat true. He is different in person, that's for certain. I don't think he's done a good job of reaching the electorate and convincing voters that the Conservatives' attack ads are not who he really is.

I also don't put much stock in polls. I've never been surveyed. but I'm sure there are some people who say one thing knowing they have intentions to vote differently.

So while I think that the NDP will make gains, I'm not sure if it will be as big as some are predicting.
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Old 05-01-2011, 03:55 PM   #35
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I can't belive this thread involves both the phrases 'passion' and 'canadian politics'. Someone give me an anecdote of where passion was involved in Canadian politics and you can win a prize.

This isn't u2 Live at Red Rocks. Not the passion of the Christ.

I admire Iggys rise up speech but passion just doesn't translate well here.

On a personal level, Iggy is kick ass. He taught at Harvard for chrissakes. maybe him and canada ust don't mix. Too bad, because I like him.
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Old 05-01-2011, 04:31 PM   #36
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I can't belive this thread involves both the phrases 'passion' and 'canadian politics'. Someone give me an anecdote of where passion was involved in Canadian politics and you can win a prize.

This isn't u2 Live at Red Rocks. Not the passion of the Christ.

I admire Iggys rise up speech but passion just doesn't translate well here.

On a personal level, Iggy is kick ass. He taught at Harvard for chrissakes. maybe him and canada ust don't mix. Too bad, because I like him.
I agreed with you about Ignatieff, I thought for a while that he could be a great leader. Maybe somebody with good and interesting ideas. But, when he got into the Canadian political machine I think he found that it served to his advantage to try and not present himself as an intellectual (due in large part to the years of attack ads, I think that is true). What we got was the "family pack" and a bunch of promises that go the same way as the NDP, but not quite as far. If the Liberals want to get back into the good graces of the Canadian people, they're going to have rethink their platform. And, yes, it would be nice to see a little passion. A little something to show that this person desires to lead, not just because it is leading, but because they think they have good ideas and could make their country a better place.
I know that sounds lofty, but why shouldn't we expect this of a potential prime minister? Must they be so cool and calculated that feeling is lost?
Iggy is using terms like "rise up" because they are words of passion. I just don't think he sold it.

So, I do take exception to your scoffing at the implication of passion in politics. These men and women aren't playing music at Red Rocks, they're supposed to be leading a country and building a democracy.
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Old 05-01-2011, 04:39 PM   #37
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I think this is an election largely about personality and positivity and less so about policy.

My father is a good example - he is a (small "c") conservative generally, but he refuses to vote for the Conservatives because a) he can't stand Stephen Harper and b) he thinks doing so legitimizes their disregard for democracy and the rule of law. So you'd think that somebody like him would fall into the Liberal camp but instead he is voting for the NDP because he thinks Ignatieff is not a leader.

And there are lots of people out there with the same view. I also think that negative ads and campaigning are not as successful in Canada generally, and while the NDP could be thin on policy in places, they have essentially run a positive campaign compared to the others. Their leader wears funky sweaters and goes to Canadiens games and still knocks door to door in neighbourhoods. By contrast you have somebody who is perceived to be a professorial robot and somebody who won't answer more than 5 questions from the media per day and tosses people from his rallies. Is it any wonder that Layton is ahead personally anyway?

I live in what is probably the most leftist-leaning riding in Toronto, where the NDP will win without much trouble. I am considering voting for the Greens. I'll decide tomorrow.
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Old 05-01-2011, 04:45 PM   #38
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I live in what is probably the most leftist-leaning riding in Toronto, where the NDP will win without much trouble. I am considering voting for the Greens. I'll decide tomorrow.
for ome reason I thought you lived in NYC.
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Old 05-01-2011, 04:58 PM   #39
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for ome reason I thought you lived in NYC.
Not anymore!
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Old 05-01-2011, 06:04 PM   #40
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The Greens have made their point about the environment and believe me it is a really good one. They have changed the agenda. But I really don't see May as a leader.

Some people are 'professional lefties' and May is such a person. Since Canada has First past the Post it really is going to be a wasted vote. Even though there is solid backing and support. Too bad really.

I agree with your fathers stance. The fact harper won't answer questions isn't he hasn't thought of answers. Or that of sceneraios that involve it. A very telling sign.

When the hell is his Coronation?
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Old 05-02-2011, 04:55 AM   #41
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Old 05-02-2011, 11:26 AM   #42
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I am voting Bloc in Ontario just to promote the absurdity of Canadian Politics.
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Old 05-02-2011, 07:48 PM   #43
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Even your elections are dorky. No news allowed until 10pm EST?
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Old 05-02-2011, 09:37 PM   #44
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Yeah it is because of the time shift. Not until all polls can be closed. You should be familiar with such things in Seattle.
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Old 05-02-2011, 09:59 PM   #45
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Whats so dorky about that?
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