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Old 02-01-2011, 04:06 PM   #91
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Which is the exact same way that the Americans support "democracy".
I was about to agree with you but then. . .I think I should first ask for clarification. Are you suggesting that--as I believe is the case with radical Islam--if certain American political groups get ahold of political power they will then suspend the democratic process? Because I don't think that is true of any serious political ideology in this country. I do believe it's true of these radical groups though--their theocratic ideology is not compatible with democracy.

If on the other hand you were saying that everyone supports democracy in the hopes of getting what they want, then yes I agree with that. I would also agree that putting the power in the hands of the people runs the risk of the people making poor judgments.
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Old 02-01-2011, 04:22 PM   #92
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Official: Egypt's Mubarak will not seek re-election - CNN.com
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Old 02-01-2011, 05:28 PM   #93
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I was about to agree with you but then. . .I think I should first ask for clarification.
I meant that the American government promotes democracy overseas only insofar as it furthers its own interests, and actually has a history of overthrowing democratic regimes when such regimes were not palatable to them.

Case in point - they were very excited about democracy in the Palestinian territories, until the Palestinians elected Hamas. Then democracy was a bad, bad thing. Salvador Allende in Chile is also a rather fantastic example of this.
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Old 02-01-2011, 05:33 PM   #94
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The probable underlying cause of the Egyptian revolution hasn't even been mentioned in the thread.
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Old 02-01-2011, 05:40 PM   #95
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The probable underlying cause of the Egyptian revolution hasn't even been mentioned in the thread.
Well, it's so secret that even you don't know it (otherwise you would've mentioned it).
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Old 02-01-2011, 05:43 PM   #96
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Originally Posted by maycocksean View Post
I was about to agree with you but then. . .I think I should first ask for clarification. Are you suggesting that--as I believe is the case with radical Islam--if certain American political groups get ahold of political power they will then suspend the democratic process? Because I don't think that is true of any serious political ideology in this country. I do believe it's true of these radical groups though--their theocratic ideology is not compatible with democracy.

Muslim extremistst will seize the opportunity to gain power by legal elections. After that, they will indeed eliminatie all form of democracy to hold on to the position of power. I certainly hope that'll never happen and it sickens me to think about that, for my love of the country.

If on the other hand you were saying that everyone supports democracy in the hopes of getting what they want, then yes I agree with that. I would also agree that putting the power in the hands of the people runs the risk of the people making poor judgments.
What Anitram says is true. Through history the US is known for supporting dictators as long as they were not communists or religious fanatics, or to support their own interest. It is known that Saddam Hussein was helped by the US to gain power to form a buffer against Iran. In Afghanistan, the US helped the Taliban to gain power to help them fight against the Russians.

And here is Egypt with dictators Mubarak and his predecessor Sadat that forms a gateway to Israel and the rest of the Middle East. Too bad for the Egyptians...
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Old 02-01-2011, 05:46 PM   #97
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Well, it's so secret that even you don't know it (otherwise you would've mentioned it).
Remember Clinton's old catchphrase, "It's the economy, stupid."

If food was cheap and the standard of living better they really wouldn't give a fuck if Mubarak built himself a thousand palaces.

US monetary policy has lead to hyperinflation in the Third World.

Egypt and Tunisia usher in the new era of global food revolutions - Telegraph
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Old 02-01-2011, 05:50 PM   #98
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the cause is the standard of living. cost of food, bread. people live 2-3 dollars a day.
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Old 02-01-2011, 05:50 PM   #99
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Remember Clinton's old catchphrase, "It's the economy, stupid."

If food was cheap and the standard of living better they really wouldn't give a fuck if Mubarak built himself a thousand palaces.

US monetary policy has lead to hyperinflation in the Third World.

Egypt and Tunisia usher in the new era of global food revolutions - Telegraph
Absolutely true. Add the poor rate of freedom of speech and you'll get some really angry masses.

Can you imagine that I send Mubarak a fan letter when I was 14 saying how much I loved the country and how eager I was to study Egyptology (that's a good one for zoo confessionals or IO, right? )
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Old 02-01-2011, 05:57 PM   #100
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I meant that the American government promotes democracy overseas only insofar as it furthers its own interests, and actually has a history of overthrowing democratic regimes when such regimes were not palatable to them.

Case in point - they were very excited about democracy in the Palestinian territories, until the Palestinians elected Hamas. Then democracy was a bad, bad thing. Salvador Allende in Chile is also a rather fantastic example of this.
Ah, America's attitude towards democracy OVERSEAS. In that case I agree with you completely.
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Old 02-01-2011, 05:59 PM   #101
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get out the jam
Hosni is toast

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Old 02-01-2011, 06:05 PM   #102
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This is a nice one too. You'll get the lyrics:

YouTube - Egypt. Hosni Mubarak

*Explanation: the guy who is shown at 1:42 is Hosni Mubaraks son Gamal.
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Old 02-01-2011, 06:47 PM   #103
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The probable underlying cause of the Egyptian revolution hasn't even been mentioned in the thread.
The article I linked in my last post lays out the underlying economic factors pretty clearly.
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Old 02-01-2011, 07:14 PM   #104
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The article I linked in my last post lays out the underlying economic factors pretty clearly.
I don't bother reading anyone else's articles.
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Old 02-01-2011, 07:50 PM   #105
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Looting attempts at the Egyptian Museum in Cairo and theft at other historic sites have underscored the vulnerability of "a cultural legacy that belongs to mankind." Can the country's antiquities and sites be protected?
Egypt Antiquities Damaged, at Risk During Unrest



Can someone - possibly Bonoa - explain to me why would some Egyptians want to destroy their heritage? Is it because they want to sell the artifacts for food?
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