Can Egypt hold it together? President's son, family flee to Britain - Page 2 - U2 Feedback

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Old 01-27-2011, 09:00 AM   #16
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i care about Egyptian Christians. why wouldn't i?
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Old 01-27-2011, 10:40 AM   #17
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Originally Posted by anitram View Post
Has his son really fled? I thought that this was a rumor?

Also, the American hypocrisy here with respect to Egypt (as say, opposed to Tunisia) would be stunning were it not par for the course for US foreign policy.

Mubaraks predecessor Sadat ruled as a dictator but because of his friendship with Israel and the west he was tolerated. After the murder of Sadat in 1981 vice president Mubarak came to power. He brought little democracy in the country, opposition was tolerated by the government, but every election the opposing parties are threatened, so it seemed that these parties were only there to show the west "what a democracy we are". The same thing happens with the press, journalists must not be too critical.

The government does nothing about poverty and unemployment, this is done by the mosques and then they ask themselves why on earth the fundamentalist organisations became popular.

The first thing I was told when I was in Egypt a couple of years ago was not to say anything critical about Mubarak or the government. The rumor goes that Mubarak killed Sadat in '81, but it's dangerous to speak it out loud in the streets, because you'll get arrested immediately. When we (a whole bunch of Egyptian and Dutch students) went out in Cairo we were actually followed a couple of times by the Egyptian secret service, so whenever we spoke about politics, we used words in Dutch or Ancient Egyptian.

After 30 years it is time for a new government! Enough is enough!
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Old 01-27-2011, 02:14 PM   #18
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i care about Egyptian Christians. why wouldn't i?
I care about the whole Egyptian population, Muslims and Christians...
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Old 01-27-2011, 03:47 PM   #19
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Bonoa -- you clearly know much more about Egypt than most of the regular posters in here. my question/concern -- if the government is overthrown, who will take their place? will democratic elections be held? is there concern that Islamists might be democratically elected? is that the change young Egyptians are looking for? something else?

sorry if i come off as grossly uninformed, that's probably because i am on this topic.
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Old 01-27-2011, 04:46 PM   #20
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YouTube - George Galloway slams Hosni Mubarak
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Old 01-27-2011, 05:10 PM   #21
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Angry Egyptian activist shouts at riot police outside the journalists' syndicate in downtown Cairo on Wednesday. (Ben Curtis/Associate Press)

http://www.cbc.ca/world/story/2011/0...o-mubarak.html
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Old 01-27-2011, 05:14 PM   #22
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Have we learned a little from our Iran experience.


Support a dictator that tolls the U S / Israeli agenda only to have the people in the street turn on him and drive him out?
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Old 01-27-2011, 05:15 PM   #23
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In general The Guardian has good coverage of this - between the extensive articles and columns you'll find most questions answered.

Egypt | World news | guardian.co.uk

And if you haven't heard this already, listen to the whole thing, amazing.

Egypt protests: 'People are being hauled out by police and beaten' - audio | World news | guardian.co.uk
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Old 01-27-2011, 08:15 PM   #24
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Spent some time in Egypt back in 95, i remember being over there when OJ was acquitted and Rabin was assassinated. There were some tense moments with the latter of the two....

We even had a security detail accompany us downtown Alexandria to get some christmas lights.

The pyramids were fun, so was drinking Stella on a hotel balcony looking out at them.
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Old 01-27-2011, 08:44 PM   #25
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For easy-access info, BBC might be even better than the Guardian; the coverage is reliably shallow, but it's also reliably broad, and well-designed for readers looking to quickly bring themselves up to speed. At times like this, I envy the legacy Britain's particular history has left its journalists--no matter where the news is happening, it seems they always have that ready reserve of well-connected, well-educated domestic and foreign expatriates to tap into.

The Muslim Brotherhood is by far the largest and best-organized opposition, so it's hard to see how any really major reshuffle wouldn't advantage them the most (of course, currently religious parties are banned, so they have to run as 'independents' and choose their priorities carefully). But pluralistic groups like the April 6 youth movement and Mohammed El Baradei's NAC have been more visible during these protests, and most eyewitnesses seem to think the very fact that no party's leading the charge is a major reason why tens of thousands of Egyptians from all walks of life have joined in to begin with. That much can't last; even when temporary alliances against a shared enemy succeed, everyone then has to back some agenda or another to move forward, and right now they agree on fairly little besides economic issues (high unemployment, low minimum wage, muzzling of unions etc.) and getting the state of emergency lifted.

I don't see this being another Tunisia, though; Mubarak's got the security forces in his pocket, he's a much savvier strongman than Ben Ali, especially at the divide-and-conquer game. But there will surely have to be some economic reforms, maybe some political ones as well (like, say, the state of emergency, or the competition-choking rules for electing the president).
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Old 01-27-2011, 10:01 PM   #26
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Protests against Egyptian president spread | Reuters
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Old 01-28-2011, 12:29 AM   #27
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Mubarak's days are numbered, the best he can hope for is to try and contain this. He could hold on a few more months, at best a year or two more.

The police and army will only stay with him until they see this is too big to contain. Once 10-15 per cent peel off, the rest will follow.

A lot depends on today, if this gets squashed, I believe it is only a matter of time before it comes back, bigger.

Quote:
A page on Facebook listed more than 30 mosques and churches where protesters were expected to gather.

"Egypt's Muslims and Christians will go out to fight against corruption, unemployment and oppression and absence of freedom," the page said, adding more than 70,000 had signed up online.
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Old 01-28-2011, 12:42 AM   #28
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mayyeuy wrote:

To all the people of world

The people in Egypt are under governmental siege. Mubarak regime is banning Facebook, Twitter, and all other popular internet sites. Tomorrow the government will block the 3 mobile phone network and the internet completely. And there is news that even the phone landline will be cut tomorrow, to prevent any news agency from following what will happen.

Suez city is already under siege now. The government cut the water supply and electricity, people, including, children and elderly are suffering there now. The patients in hospitals cannot get urgent medical care. The injured protestors are lying in the streets and the riot police are preventing people from helping them. The families of the killed protestors cannot get the bodies of their sons to bury them. This picture is the same in north Saini (El-Sheikh zoyad city) and in western Egypt (Al-salom). The riot police is cracking down on protestors in Ismailia, Alexandria, Fayoum, Shbin Elkoum, and Cairo, the capital, in many neighborhoods across the city.

The government is preparing to crackdown on the protestors in all Egyptian cities. They are using tear gas bombs, rubber and plastic pullets, chemicals like dilutes mustard gas against protestors. Several protestors today have been killed when the armored vehicles of the riot police hit them. Officials in plain clothes carrying blades and knives used to intimidate protestors.

All this has been taken place over the past three days during the peaceful demonstrations in Cairo and other cities. Now, with the suspicious silence of the local media and the lack of coverage from the international media, Mubarak and his gang are blocking all the channels that can tell the world about what is happening.

People who call for their freedom need your support and help. Will you give them a hand?

The activists are flooding the net (youtube and other sites) with thousands of pictures and videos showing the riot police firing on armless people. The police started to use ammunition against protestors. 15-year old girl has been injured and another 25 year old man has been shot in the mouth. While nothing of these has appeared in the media, there is more to happen tomorrow. Will you keep silent? Will you keep your mouth shut while seeing all these cruelty and inhumane actions?

We don’t ask for much, just broadcast what is happening
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Old 01-28-2011, 12:45 AM   #29
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NYT: Wikileaks cables reveal details of US-Egypt diplomacy -
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Old 01-28-2011, 01:11 AM   #30
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NewsHour host Jim Lehrer asked Biden if the time has "come for President Mubarak of Egypt to go?" Biden answered: "No. I think the time has come for President Mubarak to begin to move in the direction that – to be more responsive to some... of the needs of the people out there."

Asked if he would characterize Mubarak as a dictator Biden responded: “Mubarak has been an ally of ours in a number of things. And he’s been very responsible on, relative to geopolitical interest in the region, the Middle East peace efforts; the actions Egypt has taken relative to normalizing relationship with – with Israel. … I would not refer to him as a dictator.”

He also appeared to make one of the famous Biden gaffes, in comments that could be interpreted as questioning the legitimacy of protesters' demands. Monitor Cairo correspondent Kristen Chick, other reporters in the country, and activists have generally characterized the main calls of demonstrators as focused on freedom, democracy, an end to police torture, and a more committed government effort to address the poverty that aflicts millions of Egyptians.

Biden urged non-violence from both protesters and the government and said: "We’re encouraging the protesters to – as they assemble, do it peacefully. And we’re encouraging the government to act responsibly and – and to try to engage in a discussion as to what the legitimate claims being made are, if they are, and try to work them out." He also said: "I think that what we should continue to do is to encourage reasonable... accommodation and discussion to try to resolve peacefully and amicably the concerns and claims made by those who have taken to the street. And those that are legitimate should be responded to because the economic well-being and the stability of Egypt rests upon that middle class buying into the future of Egypt."

Egypt's protesters, if they're paying attention to Biden at all, will certainly be wondering which of their demands thus far have been illegitimate.


Really Mr Biden??

Egypt has a population of 80 million people. The well being of those people is secondary to 5,000,000 in an adjacent country.
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