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Old 04-09-2010, 01:03 PM   #46
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apparently the source from which wikileaks got this "unedited video" did, in fact, edit the video... taking out 20 to 30 minutes of footage in which

a) the pilots did not fire on insurgents who were attacking american troops because children were visable in the immediate area

b) held their fire on an SUV because they could not positively identify any weaponry, even though they suspected that the group in the SUV was armed.
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Old 04-09-2010, 01:12 PM   #47
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I've never been in a war, but I'm pretty sure if I was, and I had a chance to take out enemies before they posed an imminent threat, I'd go with that plan stat. And those guys did look armed to me. I still think I can see an AK-47 on one of them, but apparently that's incorrect.
I didn't say anything about not wanting to take out enemies before they posed imminent threat, I said if they don't pose an imminent threat then you have more time to actually identify if they are enemies and you should do so.
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Old 04-09-2010, 03:44 PM   #48
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I didn't say anything about not wanting to take out enemies before they posed imminent threat, I said if they don't pose an imminent threat then you have more time to actually identify if they are enemies and you should do so.
What more could they have done to identify them? Having weapons on them is pretty much the only thing that can identify them as such.
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Old 04-09-2010, 03:50 PM   #49
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What more could they have done to identify them? Having weapons on them is pretty much the only thing that can identify them as such.
Verify that they are weapons. Those things have wicked zoom. It was obvious to me they weren't weapons, some say they had a hard time telling, but a trained soldier should know better.
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Old 04-10-2010, 10:17 AM   #50
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Verify that they are weapons. Those things have wicked zoom. It was obvious to me they weren't weapons, some say they had a hard time telling, but a trained soldier should know better.
see it's funny because it seemed obvious to me that there was an AK and an RPG.

apparently there wasn't... but if someone put a gun to my head and asked me "is there an AK47 and an RPG in that video?" i would answer yes... and i guess i'd be dead, but i'd still answer yes.


and i'd also like to know why the person or group who leaked this video felt it neccesary to cut images out that showed the pilots showing restraint.

i suppose it didn't fit their argument that they're a bunch of cold blooded killers who caliously opened fire.

the argument that the soldiers honest to god believed that they saw an RPG and an AK47 becomes a lot more believable when joined up with video of the soldiers NOT firing on a crowd because they saw children around, and NOT firing on a truck because they could not verify that there were armed people inside, even though they thought there was.
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Old 04-10-2010, 11:50 AM   #51
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Verify that they are weapons. Those things have wicked zoom. It was obvious to me they weren't weapons, some say they had a hard time telling, but a trained soldier should know better.
It seems like you're the only one it doesn't think they looked like weapons. Also, I believe their cameras were zoomed in at their highest magnification.
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Old 04-10-2010, 12:29 PM   #52
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It seems like you're the only one it doesn't think they looked like weapons. Also, I believe their cameras were zoomed in at their highest magnification.
Isnt that sort of irrelevant though? Because they didnt have weapons. So if they were at full magnification (seems to be the case) then the helicopters were just too far away to reliably make that call, but did anyway. Seems to me that the pilots were pump up with adrenaline with the anticipation of going into battle (fair enough) and were too quick to engage the group
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Old 04-12-2010, 12:51 PM   #53
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would you care to justify that same argument that they are just "pumped up on adrenaline" in relation to the fact that video of them showing restraint was cut out of the footage?

those two things seem to contradict themselves...
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Old 04-12-2010, 12:57 PM   #54
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would you care to justify that same argument that they are just "pumped up on adrenaline" in relation to the fact that video of them showing restraint was cut out of the footage?

those two things seem to contradict themselves...
Seeing as how they showed restraint after the initial engagement, they dont contradict at all
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Old 04-13-2010, 09:40 AM   #55
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they don't contradict because that would hurt your argument.

one would think that if they were bloodthirsty, trigger happy pilots amped up on adreniline, that they would be even more amped up the second time around, not less.

but i guess that doesn't fit, so let's ignore it.
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Old 04-13-2010, 09:52 AM   #56
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Stephen Colbert Grills Wikileaks Founder on Helicopter Video - wikileaks - Gawker
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Old 04-13-2010, 02:26 PM   #57
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they don't contradict because that would hurt your argument.

one would think that if they were bloodthirsty, trigger happy pilots amped up on adreniline, that they would be even more amped up the second time around, not less.

but i guess that doesn't fit, so let's ignore it.
To be honest, I get tired of playing war games after an hour or so.
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Old 04-13-2010, 03:23 PM   #58
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Originally Posted by Headache in a Suitcase View Post
they don't contradict because that would hurt your argument.

one would think that if they were bloodthirsty, trigger happy pilots amped up on adreniline, that they would be even more amped up the second time around, not less.

but i guess that doesn't fit, so let's ignore it.
Give your fucking head a shake. Thats not how adrenaline works. Not to mention diminishing returns, if you want to go that far. They dont contradict for the reason I stated. Bloodthirsty? Dont put words in my mouth. Seriously though, I'm done talking to you about this. I'll go ahead and assume you'll want the last word, so enjoy
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Old 04-14-2010, 03:15 AM   #59
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No matter your view on this particular incident, just remember that it isn't the only case. This is just scraping the top.

t r u t h o u t | Iraq War Vet: "We Were Told to Just Shoot People, and the Officers Would Take Care of Us"
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Old 04-14-2010, 11:30 AM   #60
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Give your fucking head a shake. Thats not how adrenaline works. Not to mention diminishing returns, if you want to go that far. They dont contradict for the reason I stated. Bloodthirsty? Dont put words in my mouth. Seriously though, I'm done talking to you about this. I'll go ahead and assume you'll want the last word, so enjoy
i'd like your last word on how, two days ago, the person who leaked the video said that people in the group did have an AK47 and an RPG.

and how the video was edited and presented for "maximum political gain."
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