Bono on "Huckabee" Saturday night

[The Panther]

Which part do you think has not worked out so well for Bono...the rock star thing or the activist thing?

I said nothing about it not working out for him. Bono has achieved a lot as both a musician and an activist, and, as already stated, I give him credit for it. Please stop putting words in my mouth!

And he doesn't even belong in the same sentence w/the other "celebrities" you mentioned.

Er... yeah, I think that was for exaggerated effect. I am aware that Bono and Justin Bieber are not peers, thanks.

And if he didn't spend time chatting up "dodgy politicians and right wingers", there would likely be a lot more dead Africans today.

That's assuming that the dodgy politicians and right wingers have taken action, entirely due to Bono's bending their ears, to save lives. It seems to me that Bono's successes with the One campaign have a lot to do with the raising of awareness and Bono's celebrity currency and little to do with right wing politicians. So, no, I don't think there would be a lot more "dead Africans" if Bono hadn't talked to Jesse Helms.

So you decide what's more important...Bono catering to the political sensitivities of his fans, or saving lives?

Not funny. By reducing this interesting issue to a non-argumentative reactionary and extreme position, you've attempted to make your point in a faulty way.

Another way of taking your extreme argument to further examples is to discuss, say, racism in the United States and the modern Civil Rights movement. Are you going to apply your logic to every situation of racial oppression and de-humanization of racist, segregated states like the USA prior to 1960, and argue that the best thing for black activists to do would have always been to swim with the sharks? Would Malcolm X have been more effective if he had shaken hands and posed for photos with Lydon Johnson? Would Martin King have been effective if he had decided not to speak out against the Vietnam War -- thereby losing several of his supporters, as he did -- in order to gain easier access to dinners in the White House? Would it not have been better to preserve the myth of the "contented darkie house slave" rather than to have uprisings against injustice?

Yes, I'm making ridiculous, extreme examples, but that's exactly what you've done to me with your absurd question, above.

Obviously, what this essentially comes down to is this: Is there a point where those attempting to make change for the better need to draw a line in the sand that they will not cross? As regards Bono's activism (or anyone's), I would answer "yes" and perhaps you would answer "no". We simply have different perspectives, and there's probably no need to infer that I want to kill Africans.

 

[Mrs. Garrison]

I haven't watched the interview yet, but this post is totally

thanks

Joking aside, Bono is a fine diplomat.

agreed

 

[Nick66]

I said nothing about it not working out for him. Bono has achieved a lot as both a musician and an activist, and, as already stated, I give him credit for it. Please stop putting words in my mouth!

Er... yeah, I think that was for exaggerated effect. I am aware that Bono and Justin Bieber are not peers, thanks.

That's assuming that the dodgy politicians and right wingers have taken action, entirely due to Bono's bending their ears, to save lives. It seems to me that Bono's successes with the One campaign have a lot to do with the raising of awareness and Bono's celebrity currency and little to do with right wing politicians. So, no, I don't think there would be a lot more "dead Africans" if Bono hadn't talked to Jesse Helms.

Not funny. By reducing this interesting issue to a non-argumentative reactionary and extreme position, you've attempted to make your point in a faulty way.

Another way of taking your extreme argument to further examples is to discuss, say, racism in the United States and the modern Civil Rights movement. Are you going to apply your logic to every situation of racial oppression and de-humanization of racist, segregated states like the USA prior to 1960, and argue that the best thing for black activists to do would have always been to swim with the sharks? Would Malcolm X have been more effective if he had shaken hands and posed for photos with Lydon Johnson? Would Martin King have been effective if he had decided not to speak out against the Vietnam War -- thereby losing several of his supporters, as he did -- in order to gain easier access to dinners in the White House? Would it not have been better to preserve the myth of the "contented darkie house slave" rather than to have uprisings against injustice?

Yes, I'm making ridiculous, extreme examples, but that's exactly what you've done to me with your absurd question, above.

Obviously, what this essentially comes down to is this: Is there a point where those attempting to make change for the better need to draw a line in the sand that they will not cross? As regards Bono's activism (or anyone's), I would answer "yes" and perhaps you would answer "no". We simply have different perspectives, and there's probably no need to infer that I want to kill Africans.

I didn't imply that you wanted to kill Africans...and it's absurd to imply that I did, so let's get that out of the way right now. You inferred that (incorrectly).

You said you wanted Bono to not spend so much time talking to "dodgy politicians and right wingers". I merely pointed out that those talks likely...well, not likely, definitely, contributed to saving lives. George Bush, for example, one of the "dodgy politicians and right wingers" that Bono talked to spent more money on aid to Africa, an particular anti-virul drugs, than all his predecessors combined. I'd say that's "taking action." And he's specifically mentioned Bono's lobbying as contributing to this. That single fact saved more lives than anything the ONE campaign has done. There are countless organisations like ONE. It's a noble org, but Bono's direct lobbying of foreign leaders is FAR more effective than anything ONE has done. That's not my opinion, that's a fact. So, I have absolutely no problem w/saying that Bono was right to talk to Bush...or any pol who's going to help w/his cause.

Hmmm...and I never mentioned Jesse Helms, you did. That's what we call a straw man. Please stop putting words in my mouth.

I'm not a Republican, and certainly not a Bush fan (and Huckabee frankly creeps me out), but that doesn't mean I can't recognise the logic of what Bono is doing...and I'm not so blindly partisan that I have a knee jerk reaction when Bono talks to someone I might disagree with. You certainly can't argue w/Bono's success.

If Bono only talked to pols his fans (i.e. you) approved of, he'd have a lot of doors shut to him, and would not be a tenth as effective as he is. He'd be a joke celebrity activists like scores of others.

Sorry, but my reasoning is completely sound, and there's no fault in it at all. We do agree, however, that your examples are, to use your words, "ridiculous" and "extreme", however, so there's no need for me to address those.

I think there are Bono hater threads elsewhere around the internet, perhaps you'd feel more comfortable there.

 

[lemonfly]

It is possible to recognize qualities of your opponents without necessarily agreeing with everything about them.

I believe Bono once said (a long time ago) that no other political figure made him experience such intense anger as Ronald Reagan did. It's probably fair to say he despised Reagan at one point. Reagan did not seem to be merely an opponent to him, it went much deeper than that. Now he's said something complimentary about him. He may have said it in sincerity, or to curry favor with Huckabee, either way it makes my skin crawl a little. Some people call it "dancing with the devil" or "arse licking". I understand he wants political figures on both sides to continue taking meetings with him, but it leaves a bad taste in my mouth.

 

[mama cass]

i get where B-man is coming from, but do sometimes wonder if he's risking his own credibility when he makes throwaway statements like that though... i think the statement was meaningless, but still people will try and read all kinds of crap into every word he says won't they...

i think he can be too nice to people sometimes and i think people also use him for their own agendas too... i mean, look at Glenn Beck - B-man appeared civil to him, posed for pics at Spider-Man for instance, then Beck, like an arsehole, goes and ridicules him later on his show...

 

[Earnie Shavers]

Huckabee makes me feel ill. I get why he does it, but it's a shame Bono has to stoop that low.

 

[Niceman]

As an a outsider to the US, I don't see Huckabee as a crazy and why people on the left don't embrace him. I see him as a Republican I would actually vote for. (If I were to vote Republican). What has he done that is so wrong?

For starters, the beginning of his show the night Bono was on, he was ranting against the morning after pill. He called it "abortion in a pill." He opposes abortion even in cases of rape or incest, and is in favor, literally, of declaring a fertilized egg a person. To be clear - that was recently a ballot proposal and he was in favor of it! It would have made a miscarriage cause for a murder investigation!

 

[Earnie Shavers]

Preacher stealing hearts on a cable show.

 

[corianderstem]

... but still people will try and read all kinds of crap into every word he says won't they...

Just his fans. Or the people who hate him already anyway.

While I give Huckabee credit for being able to carry on a calm discussion in a field of people who prefer to yell, scorn, interrupt or fear-monger and call it conversation, his stance on certain issues overrides anything nice I have to say about him.

But it doesn't make me think any less of Bono. It's not a surprise that he'll talk to whomever to try and reach a new audience with what he obviously thinks is worth it.

While he may fear irrelevancy (ugh) with U2's music, he doesn't strike me as being all that concerned about who he might turn off by being so willing to talk to anyone who will help him reach a bigger audience with this message.

Good for him.

 

[Nick66]

Just his fans. Or the people who hate him already anyway.

While I give Huckabee credit for being able to carry on a calm discussion in a field of people who prefer to yell, scorn, interrupt or fear-monger and call it conversation, his stance on certain issues overrides anything nice I have to say about him.

But it doesn't make me think any less of Bono. It's not a surprise that he'll talk to whomever to try and reach a new audience with what he obviously thinks is worth it.

While he may fear irrelevancy (ugh) with U2's music, he doesn't strike me as being all that concerned about who he might turn off by being so willing to talk to anyone who will help him reach a bigger audience with this message.

Good for him.

Indeed.

 

[bonocomet]

The show is actually repeating right now. Bono's segment is still ahead.

 

[The Panther]

Nick, your posts indicate that you are an intelligent person, so I assume you actually see further than your I'm-willing-to-debate-Bono's-methods-therefore-I-hate-him comment suggests. Obviously, I do not hate Bono (in fact, I love him). As I've now stated twice, I greatly respect his activism and his commitment to it.

You are quite clearly convinced that Bono is responsible for the saving of African lives. I infer that you know a lot more about the One Foundation (or whatever it's called) than I do, so you may be right about that. I hope you are. My own feeling is that it is not Bono per se that is responsible for the foundation's success as much as it is the dozens of (frankly, anonymous) men and women who have dedicated their lives and careers to activism. Whether or not the foundation has actually saved lives, I do not know, but yes, I suspect that is possible, indirectly at least. As for George Bush's advocacy of aid... I wouldn't necessarily take that at face value. These politicians know exactly how to "use" people like Bono for their photo-ops and headlines (Bono, of course, is well aware of this). For all we know, Bush had already mandated the aid offered and he wanted the Bono photo-op first by which to appeal to the younger, more "liberal" voters.


Anyway, the point I was trying to make above -- you seem to have glossed over it -- is whether 'tis better to stand up and say what's true all the time, or to make bed-fellows with people whose values you sharply disagree with for the common good. I can see the benefit of both approaches from the celebrity's perspective.

Take, for example, Louis 'Satchmo' Armstrong. A black man born in turn-of-the-century New Orleans, he knew of no other way of life -- even to his last month alive -- than to have a white man looking out for him, to keep him safe. That was his business philosophy. Armstrong saw himself as an entertainer and not an artist, and therefore he was content to indulge whites' racist stereotypes onstage and in film. He was called out for it by the generation of blacks that followed him, and even his friends (like Billie Holiday) said he was a(n Uncle) Tom. So successful was he at not offending middle-class whites that the State Department, at the height of the Cold War, considered sending Armstrong to the USSR as a Goodwill Ambassador (i.e., he was a "safe" black entertainer). Then, in 1957, after the "Little Rock Nine" schoolchildren were attacked and assaulted for attempting to integrate their high school, Armstrong suddenly said it straight and called the President of the United States "two-faced" and lots of other names. Out of nowhere, Armstrong called it like it was. And people paid attention. Days later, Truman sent the National Guard to the South for the first time since the Civil War to protect those children.

The debate rages on -- did Armstrong do more for American society by being a family-oriented, white-friendly entertainer, who smiled onstage but had to sleep in school gymnasiums on tour because Southern hotels wouldn't let him enter, or did he do more by correcting the President and speaking the truth plainly to the press?

I don't know, but the fact that I'm willing to consider such issues doesn't mean I hate Bono.

 

[Utoo]

Take, for example, Louis 'Satchmo' Armstrong. A black man born in turn-of-the-century New Orleans, he knew of no other way of life -- even to his last month alive -- than to have a white man looking out for him, to keep him safe. That was his business philosophy. Armstrong saw himself as an entertainer and not an artist, and therefore he was content to indulge whites' racist stereotypes onstage and in film. He was called out for it by the generation of blacks that followed him, and even his friends (like Billie Holiday) said he was a(n Uncle) Tom. So successful was he at not offending middle-class whites that the State Department, at the height of the Cold War, considered sending Armstrong to the USSR as a Goodwill Ambassador (i.e., he was a "safe" black entertainer). Then, in 1957, after the "Little Rock Nine" schoolchildren were attacked and assaulted for attempting to integrate their high school, Armstrong suddenly said it straight and called the President of the United States "two-faced" and lots of other names. Out of nowhere, Armstrong called it like it was. And people paid attention. Days later, Ike Turner sent the National Guard to the South for the first time since the Civil War to protect those children.

Ike Turner??

 

[canedge]

Panther leave the race examples off this discussion. Everyone is tired of Americas history.

 

[The Panther]

Ike Turner??

Thanks; I fixed it.

 

[The Panther]

Panther leave the race examples off this discussion. Everyone is tired of Americas history.

Okay, what subject do you deem worthy of analogy?

 

[canedge]

what point are you trying to make?

Nevermind. Got it.

'tis better to stand up and say what's true all the time, or to make bed-fellows with people whose values you sharply disagree with for the common good

 

[canedge]

I think it is better to make bed-fellows when lives are at stake.

 

[kassandra]

I still think it was fancy editing so that FOX news could set a tone.

The interview is wonderful and well stated. Huckabee even asked some very good questions, not the typical ones. That last statement is clearly not finished. There must be more to it.

Its not about Bono speaking to Huckabee, its what people like FOX news do with what was said.

 

[canedge]

Yeah the last ten seconds of the part are dodgy. The fake audience noise is really audible.

 

[Mrs. Garrison]

U2 Frontman BONO Endorses Gingrich, Compares him to Lincoln; lots of hits.

 

[corianderstem]

 

[Rachel D.]

Bono's a conservative now, you guys. What do you think about that? Better burn your fan cards and go listen to Radiohead.

 

[corianderstem]

That last statement is clearly not finished. There must be more to it.

I have the cut footage where Bono calls Rick Perry a fuckwad.

I can't share it, or Rupert Murdoch and Roger Ailes will have me killed.

But it's pretty awesome.

 

[Caleb8844]

That last statement is clearly not finished. There must be more to it.

I'm not sure what he could've said after that to change the meaning of that. Other than "JK! I want you dead."

 

[ryancoke71]

I was missing the Daily Show thread, so this is filling the void!

 

[gvox]

Take, for example, Louis 'Satchmo' Armstrong.
.
.
And people paid attention. Days later, Truman sent the National Guard to the South for the first time since the Civil War to protect those children.

The debate rages on -- did Armstrong do more for American society by being a family-oriented, white-friendly entertainer, who smiled onstage but had to sleep in school gymnasiums on tour because Southern hotels wouldn't let him enter, or did he do more by correcting the President and speaking the truth plainly to the press?

You stopped just short of realizing an important thing here tho Panther...Armstrong's currency as a celebrity included the rapport he had built up with "the enemy". Had he not done that, noone would have paid attention to him. He leveraged his position for good. Bono's currency as a celebrity isn't much different.

You can retain your soul and your street cred with your people (or, fans) all you want...but if you want the majority of the world to pay attention when you speak, you have to have attempted to bridge the gap between you and them beforehand. In so doing, there will always be people who will call you a sell out/uncle Tom, etc. That's how regressive minds work.

 

[Nick66]

Nick, your posts indicate that you are an intelligent person, so I assume you actually see further than your I'm-willing-to-debate-Bono's-methods-therefore-I-hate-him comment suggests. Obviously, I do not hate Bono (in fact, I love him). As I've now stated twice, I greatly respect his activism and his commitment to it.

You are quite clearly convinced that Bono is responsible for the saving of African lives. I infer that you know a lot more about the One Foundation (or whatever it's called) than I do, so you may be right about that. I hope you are. My own feeling is that it is not Bono per se that is responsible for the foundation's success as much as it is the dozens of (frankly, anonymous) men and women who have dedicated their lives and careers to activism. Whether or not the foundation has actually saved lives, I do not know, but yes, I suspect that is possible, indirectly at least. As for George Bush's advocacy of aid... I wouldn't necessarily take that at face value. These politicians know exactly how to "use" people like Bono for their photo-ops and headlines (Bono, of course, is well aware of this). For all we know, Bush had already mandated the aid offered and he wanted the Bono photo-op first by which to appeal to the younger, more "liberal" voters.


Anyway, the point I was trying to make above -- you seem to have glossed over it -- is whether 'tis better to stand up and say what's true all the time, or to make bed-fellows with people whose values you sharply disagree with for the common good. I can see the benefit of both approaches from the celebrity's perspective.

Take, for example, Louis 'Satchmo' Armstrong. A black man born in turn-of-the-century New Orleans, he knew of no other way of life -- even to his last month alive -- than to have a white man looking out for him, to keep him safe. That was his business philosophy. Armstrong saw himself as an entertainer and not an artist, and therefore he was content to indulge whites' racist stereotypes onstage and in film. He was called out for it by the generation of blacks that followed him, and even his friends (like Billie Holiday) said he was a(n Uncle) Tom. So successful was he at not offending middle-class whites that the State Department, at the height of the Cold War, considered sending Armstrong to the USSR as a Goodwill Ambassador (i.e., he was a "safe" black entertainer). Then, in 1957, after the "Little Rock Nine" schoolchildren were attacked and assaulted for attempting to integrate their high school, Armstrong suddenly said it straight and called the President of the United States "two-faced" and lots of other names. Out of nowhere, Armstrong called it like it was. And people paid attention. Days later, Truman sent the National Guard to the South for the first time since the Civil War to protect those children.

The debate rages on -- did Armstrong do more for American society by being a family-oriented, white-friendly entertainer, who smiled onstage but had to sleep in school gymnasiums on tour because Southern hotels wouldn't let him enter, or did he do more by correcting the President and speaking the truth plainly to the press?

I don't know, but the fact that I'm willing to consider such issues doesn't mean I hate Bono.

I don't think your analogies are apt, or appropriate, and I'll take you at your word that you don't hate Bono. But I believe you're absolutely wrong on this issue. No reasonable person who watched what Bush did in Africa, or even saw his persuasiveness in the interview w/Huckabee, can conclude that Bono should not have spoken w/those men. Bush's motivations for meeting w/Bono are irrelevant, I'm sure he was "using" him to a certain extent, just as Bono was using Bush. Their motivations don't matter, what matters is the result.

In any event, Bono and Huckabee agree on this issue, and Huckabee has been active w/the ONE Campaign...so why shouldn't they talk? Under those circumstances, it would be unusual if Bono didn't talk to him? Bono shouldn't try to reach Huckabee's audience? People who are likely to hear and respond to Bono's call to action on AIDS as a Christian mission? Bono's supposed to diss the guy because he might disagree on some other issues? Please. We all disagree on things...but isn't it about coming together on the things we can agree on? If people refused to speak and work w/others because they might disagree on some issues not a whole lot would get done. Do you agree w/everyone you work with? It was absolutely appropriate he went on there, and in fact would have been odd not to.

I'm sorry, but in this instance your way is wrong and Bonos is right.

 

[Nick66]

Bono's a conservative now, you guys. What do you think about that?

Not sure if you're being glib or not, but this is probably true in many ways. At least he's more conservative than he used to be.

You haven't heard Bono, who sits on the board of a private equity firm, say anything about Occupy Wall Street. And you won't.

 

[LemonMelon]

U2 Frontman BONO Endorses Gingrich, Compares him to Lincoln; lots of hits.

U2 frontman BONO unveils new tour concept: "I'll fly over the crowd on a giant red elephant; sing lots of hits."