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Old 02-23-2014, 05:11 PM   #106
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I want to walk into traffic.
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Old 02-23-2014, 07:35 PM   #107
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Everyone is deserving of respect and compassion on a micro or personal level but society needs to be able to discuss issues on a macro level. Of coarse you don't shun a family member or close friend if they choose to drop out of school, suffer from substance abuse, become a single parent or other things that as a society we should continue to discourage or attach stigmas to.

You might think you're being compassionate for excusing or ignoring the cost to society but you're actually just increasing the chances of more and more individuals suffering the hardships and pathologies of these type decisions.
Society need not be made to accommodate the internal sexual confusion of so few and certainly should not add to the confusion by condoning the abolition of the idea of male and female as two distinctive sexes or promoting the idea of subjective genders.

Ohh thanks mate, I haven't laughed so hard in a long while
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Old 02-23-2014, 07:55 PM   #108
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Society need not be made to accommodate the internal sexual confusion of so few and certainly should not add to the confusion by condoning the abolition of the idea of male and female as two distinctive sexes or promoting the idea of subjective genders.

what are you even talking about?



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I agree with you completely, but I wouldn't bring this up in the same-sex marriage thread. They will tell you that SSM should be legal because gays have no more control over their orientation than blacks do over their pigmentation.
well, we could talk about how race actually is a social construct, or we could revisit history and the "one drop" rule and talk about how environment constructs race, we could talk about people who "pass" for one race or the other, but that might be a bit too complex for you, given this statement.

sexual orientation is fixed by a very early age and is in large part genetic but, most importantly, it is unchosen. no one has ever said that sexual orientation = race, but that each is unchosen.




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Because no matter how hard one wishes it they cannot change their sex. I'll go with medical science over psychology and feminist gender-theory on this matter.

again, you don't know what you're talking about. and, if anything, this belief should make you more compassionate towards those who do struggle with their gender since they really are trapped by their fixed biology.

but jeevy is right, there are individuals who are intersexed. usually, they will choose whichever gender is more comfortable and live as that, but they are biologically male and female. so, stick with medical science on this one.
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Old 02-23-2014, 07:56 PM   #109
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I want to walk into traffic.
Indy's posts have that effect on people.
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Old 02-23-2014, 08:10 PM   #110
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They knocked me out on my trainride home, so I guess I'm grateful?
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Old 02-23-2014, 08:18 PM   #111
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INDY seems to have a serious problem against people who are not like him.
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Old 02-23-2014, 08:20 PM   #112
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Originally Posted by INDY500 View Post
Everyone is deserving of respect and compassion on a micro or personal level but society needs to be able to discuss issues on a macro level. Of coarse you don't shun a family member or close friend if they choose to drop out of school, suffer from substance abuse, become a single parent or other things that as a society we should continue to discourage or attach stigmas to.

You might think you're being compassionate for excusing or ignoring the cost to society but you're actually just increasing the chances of more and more individuals suffering the hardships and pathologies of these type decisions.
Society need not be made to accommodate the internal sexual confusion of so few and certainly should not add to the confusion by condoning the abolition of the idea of male and female as two distinctive sexes or promoting the idea of subjective genders.
Honestly - and please take offence if you so wish - this is one of the dumbest things I have ever read. Never have I seen someone get up on their moral high horse so high over something so ridiculous. I still think terms like cismale and cisfemale are pretentious, but I have absolutely no qualms whatsoever with people who want to refer to themselves as such if they see fit. It doesn't affect me at all, never will, and the world is not going to crumble in on itself as a result.

This is not to mention the fact that you seem to think issues of gender identity are analogous to drug addiction...? Or that being a single parent is abominable? Or that dropping out of school is automatically a bad thing?

Can you tell me what it's like to only be able to see black and white?
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Old 02-23-2014, 08:56 PM   #113
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Honestly - and please take offence if you so wish - this is one of the dumbest things I have ever read. Never have I seen someone get up on their moral high horse so high over something so ridiculous. I still think terms like cismale and cisfemale are pretentious, but I have absolutely no qualms whatsoever with people who want to refer to themselves as such if they see fit. It doesn't affect me at all, never will, and the world is not going to crumble in on itself as a result.
This.
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Old 02-23-2014, 09:05 PM   #114
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If only it were still this easy.

Nancy Kwan - I Enjoy Being A Girl - YouTube





For the record, Flower Drum Song is one of my favorite movies.
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Old 02-23-2014, 10:00 PM   #115
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Biological sex and gender identity: differences and overlaps

Quote:
Originally Posted by INDY500 View Post
Everyone is deserving of respect and compassion on a micro or personal level but society needs to be able to discuss issues on a macro level.
Of course.

Quote:
Of coarse you don't shun a family member or close friend if they choose to drop out of school, suffer from substance abuse, become a single parent or other things that as a society we should continue to discourage or attach stigmas to.
It might interest you to know that for a large portion of the population, being gay or identifying as a different gender than your birth one are not things that we as a society should continue to discourage or attach stigmas to.

Quote:
You might think you're being compassionate for excusing or ignoring the cost to society but you're actually just increasing the chances of more and more individuals suffering the hardships and pathologies of these type decisions.
You know, your claims of a "cost to society" might be an effective debate strategy of you could actually produce any evidence to support it.
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Old 02-23-2014, 11:48 PM   #116
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Should we pretend a human can become a cat or lizard through body modification and self-delusion?
ugh.
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Old 02-25-2014, 08:23 PM   #117
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What do you make of individuals with Turner Syndrome (XXX), Klinefelter Syndrome (XXY), XYY Syndrome, or one of the tetrasomies (like XXXY, XYYY) or pentasomies?
Is that who we're talking about? I would leave transsexuals out as well because they fell strongly enough to seek reassignment surgery. I would consider a transsexual female a female.
I did mention that there is a very small percentage of the population with sexual identity disassociations.
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Old 02-25-2014, 08:36 PM   #118
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what are you even talking about?





well, we could talk about how race actually is a social construct, or we could revisit history and the "one drop" rule and talk about how environment constructs race, we could talk about people who "pass" for one race or the other, but that might be a bit too complex for you, given this statement.

sexual orientation is fixed by a very early age and is in large part genetic but, most importantly, it is unchosen. no one has ever said that sexual orientation = race, but that each is unchosen.
Pretty sure you always make the analogy between SSM and anti-miscegenation laws.

Quote:

again, you don't know what you're talking about. and, if anything, this belief should make you more compassionate towards those who do struggle with their gender since they really are trapped by their fixed biology.

but jeevy is right, there are individuals who are intersexed. usually, they will choose whichever gender is more comfortable and live as that, but they are biologically male and female. so, stick with medical science on this one.
You know where this is going with 50+ genders. Increased sexual confusion, the need for "anti-transgender laws," lawsuits and accommodation by all of society regarding bathrooms, school sports, etc. See MA and CA recent laws.
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Old 02-25-2014, 08:41 PM   #119
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Can you explain and give an example and then a negative societal effect of "increased gender confusion."
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Old 02-25-2014, 08:45 PM   #120
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ugh.
Sorry you feel the need to marginalize the trans-species community. Inclusiveness requires that their voices and contribution to diversity be brought out from the shadows.

Henceforth I will identify as a cisHomo sapien.
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