I'm curious what the distinction is between the personal level and a broader level that allows one to publicly decry as a larger group individuals who you would empathize with one on one.
Biological sex and gender identity: differences and overlaps
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I'm curious what the distinction is between the personal level and a broader level that allows one to publicly decry as a larger group individuals who you would empathize with one on one.
LemonMelon
More 5G Than Man
It's always the one you least suspect.
jeevey
Rock n' Roll Doggie Band-aid
Indy, your ignorance and rudeness is astonishing.
cobl04
45:33
^ truth.
I actually did not know what those cis- prefixes meant. I'm sorry but I'm going to go ahead and say that's a load of shit. You do not need to put a prefix in front of your gender if you identify with that gender and were born that gender. I find that pretty pretentious. I was born male, and I identify as male, so I am male.
I actually did not know what those cis- prefixes meant. I'm sorry but I'm going to go ahead and say that's a load of shit. You do not need to put a prefix in front of your gender if you identify with that gender and were born that gender. I find that pretty pretentious. I was born male, and I identify as male, so I am male.
LuckyNumber7
Blue Crack Addict
I think the point of cisgender is to compliment transgender. Yeah, it may seem pretentious on first thought, but I think those who choose to identify as it do so entirely aware that it is the same thing as "male/female" and choose to remove those terms of gender in place for a "gender identity" instead.
cobl04
45:33
but it still has the words male and female in them. cismale, cisfemale.
LuckyNumber7
Blue Crack Addict
I'm aware. I'm saying instead of [male, female] it is [cisgender, transgender] or [cismale, cisfemale, transmale, transfemale].
I don't think anyone identifies as cisgender in order to be pretentious or to stand out, but rather to draw attention to something that is otherwise considered abnormal or taboo.
PhilsFan
Blue Crack Addict
They're not asking you to change you driver's license. I think Facebook's point here (which they're allowed to do because HEY INDY THEY ARE A PRIVATE COMPANY!!!!!!! FREE FUCKING ENTERPRISE YEAAAAAAHHHHHHH!!!!!) is to bring awareness to trans* issues, which seems noble enough.
INDY500
Rock n' Roll Doggie Band-aid
You had the advance of being raised in a 2 box world. The next generation will bathe in the indoctrinating amniotic fluid of 50 (and counting) genders to emerge somewhat less certain than you or I.
That's right, what sex you are attracted to is determined before birth but your actual sex is subjective and can change as often as the weather. Welcome to the brave new world.
PhilsFan
Blue Crack Addict
You're exactly right. Now that people have choices on how to self-identify on Facebook, I suddenly have lost all confidence on who I am as a person. Yup. That happened.
CONSEQUENCES!
CONSEQUENCES!
LuckyNumber7
Blue Crack Addict
I think the more important point exists -- why do you care what people call themselves?
martha
Blue Crack Supplier
It's fricking hilarious that Indy give this much of a shit how complete strangers identify themselves on Facebook.
PhilsFan
Blue Crack Addict
It's all a slippery slope to boys wearing dresses in INDY's mind. This, gay marriage, the lot of it. He's scared shitless that gender is going to become meaningless because we're finally recognizing a segment of our society that we cast aside for far too long.
You're absolutely right. What frightening times we live in. Rather than have these people (who you would claim to empathize with in person) out of sight and out of mind, now you might have to occasionally deal with their reality (which again, you would claim to empathize with) showing itself in yours.
It really must be tough for you.
LuckyNumber7
Blue Crack Addict
I could ask the same question all day though. Why do you care if boys wear dresses?
At what point is there actually a consequence that isn't just "something I'm not used to?"
Aygo
Rock n' Roll Doggie
No, it isn't. That's not the consensus in the cientific community and that's not what the American Psychological Association thinks. What is believed and taken as true is that sexual orientation has origin in a mix of factors: biological, psychological and social. It is believed that genetics may influence the predisposition towards one specific sexual orientation.
Plus, the sexual orientation is not a tight concept, since no one is 100% one thing or the other. Every single individual has both heterossexual and homossexual pulsions, regardless of the most dominant sexual orientation in that person, even asexual people do.
Irvine511
Blue Crack Supplier
i'm starting to cringe now. you don't even understand the terms you're criticizing (sex vs. gender, just to begin).
Galeongirl
Galeonbroad
Ah, that is pretty similar then indeed. As the cis configuration has both special groups on the same side of a C=C bond, and the trans has them on opposite sides. I agree with Cobbler though, I don't really see the need to add the cis prefix.
Got a problem with that????
Aygo
Rock n' Roll Doggie
"It's very simple" (Zoo TV mode): sex is more of a biological concept (although also dependant on historical/cultural/social/antropological factors and variations); gender is a social construction, dependant on the cultural meanings of a certain society or group and on the experience/living of the individual.
It's awakward for us, occidentals, but certain societies don't have or don't make gender distinction, while others (unlike ours, structured in a heteronormative and sexually binary system) are structured in multi-gender references.
bono_212
Blue Crack Distributor
Me too, I can just picture some pretentious ass referring to himself as cismale just for the benefit of being asked what it means.
LuckyNumber7
Blue Crack Addict
You guys seem to think that it's automatically going to be some pretentious asshole. It's just a term coined for inclusion of transsexuality.
Galeongirl
Galeonbroad
Yes but it's not necessary. I'm not gonna say I'm femalefemale right? so why bother adding the cis prefix when it is exactly that?
I don't know the precise English term for it, but in Dutch we call it double word usage and it's grammatically wrong. Thus it irks me.
I don't know the precise English term for it, but in Dutch we call it double word usage and it's grammatically wrong.
Thus it irks me.
LuckyNumber7
Blue Crack Addict
The Gay Thread
Cis- means along with. Trans- means across from.
You guys/gals. It's just a word used to complete the set.
You wouldn't say "sexual" and "homosexual" would you?
Cis- means along with. Trans- means across from.
You guys/gals. It's just a word used to complete the set.
You wouldn't say "sexual" and "homosexual" would you?
Galeongirl
Galeonbroad
No, because sexual and homosexual mean different things.
cismale and male mean the exact same thing.
cismale and male mean the exact same thing.
They don't...a male is just the sex you are born with, cis male is you are born as a male and identify as man....you can be a man but born as the sex, female.
I think the cis- makes it easier when you are discussing gender in relation to those who don't feel part of the regular gender binary. It's not saying your female female, but that you identify as being a woman while also being of the female sex. A woman who was born male, her gender she identifies as is as a woman, but she is obviously not cis-gendered.
It makes it easier just to identify such things especially in the literature and in discussions of such. To be honest I see no real problem with it, it's completely optional, you can identify as whatever, that's cool, it only matters really in healthcare (or at least it should).
Best thing facebook could have done would have been to leave it as a blank field you can fill in for yourself. This is only going to be used as a marketing thing anyway.
I think the cis- makes it easier when you are discussing gender in relation to those who don't feel part of the regular gender binary. It's not saying your female female, but that you identify as being a woman while also being of the female sex. A woman who was born male, her gender she identifies as is as a woman, but she is obviously not cis-gendered.
It makes it easier just to identify such things especially in the literature and in discussions of such. To be honest I see no real problem with it, it's completely optional, you can identify as whatever, that's cool, it only matters really in healthcare (or at least it should).
Best thing facebook could have done would have been to leave it as a blank field you can fill in for yourself. This is only going to be used as a marketing thing anyway.
LuckyNumber7
Blue Crack Addict
The Gay Thread
It doesn't, though. Cisgender is a term meaning "of the gender." Transgender is a term meaning "across the gender."
Homosexual being "one sex" whereas heterosexual is "a mixture of sexes."
You're right. Sexual is a different word. So is gender. Sexual is not a sexual orientation, and gender is not a gender identity.
It doesn't, though. Cisgender is a term meaning "of the gender." Transgender is a term meaning "across the gender."
Homosexual being "one sex" whereas heterosexual is "a mixture of sexes."
You're right. Sexual is a different word. So is gender. Sexual is not a sexual orientation, and gender is not a gender identity.
bono_212
Blue Crack Distributor
I'm still not seeing a purpose in an individual identifying as cisgender.
I guess clinically the term makes sense... But every explanation I'm seeing still seems to indicate that it means the exact same thing thing as saying you're male, but then going a step further to say, 'I'm male and I was born male'
I guess clinically the term makes sense... But every explanation I'm seeing still seems to indicate that it means the exact same thing thing as saying you're male, but then going a step further to say, 'I'm male and I was born male'
jeevey
Rock n' Roll Doggie Band-aid
Of course it's going to be used as a marketing tool, and that's a good thing (you'd think, for people who believe in a free market economy.) A good company designs their product in response to their customer base. It's not in fact the PC police tool that Indy claims, and you can tell it isn't because companies who are doing things because they have to NEVER do them as thoroughly as Facebook did this. (Just think of any other form you've ever seen with 'trans' as a choice and how cursory it was, like the BMV for instance.) What you can tell by this form is that Facebook is marketing themselves to trans people and others who are aware of gender identity issues. And that's nice, because they deserve to be manipulated by advertising just like the rest of us.
LuckyNumber7
Blue Crack Addict
The Gay Thread
Okay, well how about a very effeminate male who just so happens to do drag and everyone calls that person a transgender? Can you see why someone would want to identify as cismale in that case?
Okay, well how about a very effeminate male who just so happens to do drag and everyone calls that person a transgender? Can you see why someone would want to identify as cismale in that case?
