Bill Maher-Victim Of Religious Discrimination?

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INDY500 said:
You mean like Muhammad Ali used to give praise to Allah after each of his fights? And he was only named Sports Illustrated's Sportsman of the Decade. And aren't American athletes who legally change their name to a Muslim name literally putting their faith on the back of their jersey?
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yeah, Muhammad Ali wasn't controversial at all. lol.
 
Irvine511 said:
yeah, Muhammad Ali wasn't controversial at all. lol.
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True but there's many reasons for that including his association with Malcolm X, his refusing to go to Vietnam (before the war became unpopular) and his trash-talking (before everyone started trash-talking to the point that Tim Tebow's humility and humbleness is the oddity).
 
I don't think you can compare Ali's Islamness (I know that's not a word, but I'm blanking on the appropriate choice) back then to if an athlete did it today. There wasn't quite the ZOMG MUSLIMS public panic like there is these days.

Unless I'm completely misunderstanding the conversation, which is entirely possible.
 
INDY500 said:
True but there's many reasons for that including his association with Malcolm X, his refusing to go to Vietnam (before the war became unpopular) and his trash-talking (before everyone started trash-talking to the point that Tim Tebow's humility and humbleness is the oddity).
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I'm so much more important than other athletes that God wants me to win.

Yeah, so humble...
 
like i said, i don't care much about football, and this Teabow fellow is a bit obnoxious about the anti-choice thing -- "don't have an abortion even if having the baby will likely kill you! you could give birth to a professional quarterback!" -- but other than that seems like the rare professional athlete who isn't a horrible person.

what's interesting to me is, 1) what if he were Muslim (or something else unpopular), and 2) how Christians are as hungry for role models as anyone else and will overpraise "one of their own" just like anyone else from any other community.
 
BVS said:
I'm so much more important than other athletes that God wants me to win.

Yeah, so humble...
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Yeah, that reaction is bullshit, at least judging from Tebow's own words. If you want to extrapolate a sense of entitlement from the fact that Tebow prays, well, be my guest. Sounds like you're looking for a flaw that isn't there, just like everyone else.

I'm sure Tebow fights dogs or something on the side, but there's no reason to judge him prematurely.
 
LemonMelon said:
Yeah, that reaction is bullshit, at least judging from Tebow's own words. If you want to extrapolate a sense of entitlement from the fact that Tebow prays, well, be my guest. Sounds like you're looking for a flaw that isn't there, just like everyone else.

I'm sure Tebow fights dogs or something on the side, but there's no reason to judge him prematurely.
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What?! I think you and 2861 misunderstood me. This has nothing to do with prayer. The man plays football, and he plays against other Christians, right? So why think that God would choose a side? It's a game. When you attribute a win to God then you're attributing a choosing of sides, correct?
 
corianderstem said:
I don't think you can compare Ali's Islamness (I know that's not a word, but I'm blanking on the appropriate choice) back then to if an athlete did it today. There wasn't quite the ZOMG MUSLIMS public panic like there is these days.

Unless I'm completely misunderstanding the conversation, which is entirely possible.
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You'd be wrong if you think a black athlete speaking his mind about race, war and religion in the mid-sixties didn't attract public panic some attention.
 
BVS said:
What?! I think you and 2861 misunderstood me. This has nothing to do with prayer. The man plays football, and he plays against other Christians, right? So why think that God would choose a side? It's a game. When you attribute a win to God then you're attributing a choosing of sides, correct?
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I don't believe he specifically attributes victory to divine intervention, but he thanks God after wins because he personally was able to play at a high level. Kurt Warner did the same thing throughout his career but for whatever reason got less flack for it; rather than praising God for giving him a Super Bowl ring, he said "thanks, God, for helping me do what I do." Radically different statement from "hey, God, really dope of you to help us beat the Raiders!! Good hustle out there!" It's a lot less entitled.
 
Warner had two things that kept him more under the radar (other than everyone being all like, wait, not the Penn State running back?): one, he wasn't nearly as popular in college (nor as successful), and more importantly with two, he could actually throw the ball, so his success could easily be attributed to his ability as a pocket passer.

Tebow's success is unsustainable, unless there truly is divine intervention at play. He has had great fortune this season. He played some really beatable teams in the regular season, happened to be in a division where his team could go 8-8 and make the playoffs, and then got a thoroughly injured Pittsburgh defense this past week. He was able to beat them with about four good passes.
 
Irvine511 said:
2) how Christians are as hungry for role models as anyone else and will overpraise "one of their own" just like anyone else from any other community.
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Which is strange, 'cause isn't there something in the Christian faith about "false idols" and that sort of thing?

My mom hates the Patriots/Tom Brady (so did my dad), so our family's not going to be paying any sort of attention to that game this weekend. But, you know, go, team! Or something.
 
Moonlit_Angel said:
Which is strange, 'cause isn't there something in the Christian faith about "false idols" and that sort of thing?
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Umm... that's not exactly the same thing. People of faith can't have role models or look up to people without being criticized of worshiping a false god?

This is silly.
 
2861U2 said:
Umm... that's not exactly the same thing. People of faith can't have role models or look up to people without being criticized of worshiping a false god?

This is silly.
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I agree, a role model is not the same as a false idol. BUT I think most would agree that a lot of followers take it too far. The above preacher for example. I think there are a lot of followers that attribute wins and losses to God; in sports, entertainment, etc.
 
LemonMelon said:
Sounds like you're looking for a flaw that isn't there, just like everyone else.
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Please excuse my assumption, because I honestly don't pay a lot of attention to non-Packers football. But isn't he ... well .... not as good as all this hype would lead us to believe?

That should be the flaw to focus on, not that he prays after touchdowns or whatever.

Irvine511 said:
Tim Tebow comeback: Reality is now indistinguishable from Tim Tebow fan fiction. - Slate Magazine
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I eagerly await the Teabow/Harry Potter crossover.
 
corianderstem said:
Please excuse my assumption, because I honestly don't pay a lot of attention to non-Packers football. But isn't he ... well .... not as good as all this hype would lead us to believe?
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Oh yeah, like I joked to Khan earlier in the thread, he blows. As Peef said, if he were any good, nobody would attach divine intervention to his success.

When the Broncos get smacked around this weekend, I'll take note of how Tebow reacts. If he still praises God in the press conference, well, what more can you ask of him? He's not at all hypocritical or inconsistent there, and that's more than I could say of most Christians. But, again, I don't know that he did that following his losses; I didn't watch the press conferences. I didn't mean to skip over BVS' post, btw, I just didn't have any answer for him, for that reason.
 
LemonMelon said:
Oh yeah, like I joked to Khan earlier in the thread, he blows. As Peef said, if he were any good, nobody would attach divine intervention to his success.
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Wait -- I'm confused. We're talking about the guy who won a Heisman as a sophomore in college, right? They guy who set all kinds of crazy records in college ball? The guy who brought the Broncos back from a 1-4 season to finish the year at 8-6, and make it to the second round of the playoffs? #confused

Not sure what this has to do with Bill Maher, either.
 
I was basing my comment on what I'd heard about him being not great for most of the game, and then pulling it out for the last quarter. So, being inconsistent.
 
nathan1977 said:
Wait -- I'm confused. We're talking about the guy who won a Heisman as a sophomore in college, right? They guy who set all kinds of crazy records in college ball? The guy who brought the Broncos back from a 1-4 season to finish the year at 8-6, and make it to the second round of the playoffs? #confused
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The guy who led the broncos to be 31st in the league in passing?
 
nathan1977 said:
Wait -- I'm confused. We're talking about the guy who won a Heisman as a sophomore in college, right? They guy who set all kinds of crazy records in college ball? The guy who brought the Broncos back from a 1-4 season to finish the year at 8-6, and make it to the second round of the playoffs? #confused

Not sure what this has to do with Bill Maher, either.
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as another football ignorant speaking here, i think the issue regarding his abilities is that Teabow plays horribly for 3.5 quarters, and then pulls off something at the end.

For the fifth time in eight weeks, Tim Tebow and his Broncos teammates heroically overcame Tim Tebow to win a game by four points or less. The Denver quarterback, who did not complete a pass in the second and third quarters, appeared for long stretches to be playing a sport in which you score points by running the greatest possible distance laterally before flinging yourself and/or the ball into the ground. With the Broncos trailing 10-0 late in the fourth quarter, the Bears permitted Tebow to throw the ball underneath, and the Denver pass catchers—who for three quarters appeared to have feet for hands—regained the opposability in their thumbs. A Tebow-to-Demaryius Thomas touchdown pass brought Chicago's lead to three, but the timeout-less Broncos couldn't recover the subsequent onside kick, dooming them to certain defeat. And then Marion Barber began playing the worst 10 minutes of football since Tim Tebow's second quarter. First, the Bears running back wandered out of bounds, stopping the clock; Tebow would get the ball back with enough time to "drive" the Broncos lurchingly across the midfield stripe, "setting up" Matt Prater's game-tying 59-yard field goal. In overtime, the ball raptured itself out of Barber's grasp on what looked like a game-winning run, giving Tebow the opportunity to "set up" another 50-plus-yard Prater upright-splitter. Denver wins. Jesus gets another post-game thank-you note.

Ever since Tebow stepped in for Kyle Orton in Week 5, the Broncos' season has resembled Friday Night Lights, if Friday Night Lights were written by Tim LaHaye and Jerry Jenkins.
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although that would make me more likely to believe divine intervention. :shrug:
 
corianderstem said:
I was basing my comment on what I'd heard about him being not great for most of the game, and then pulling it out for the last quarter. So, being inconsistent.
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The fact that he's had to do so many come-from-behind victories would seem to indicate A) a not great defense and B) the inability of their opponents to play 60 minutes. The Patriots have been capitalizing on this for a while.
 
nathan1977 said:
The fact that he's had to do so many come-from-behind victories would seem to indicate A) a not great defense and B) the inability of their opponents to play 60 minutes. The Patriots have been capitalizing on this for a while.
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Yeah, now it's too detailed and my eyes are glazing over. :)
 
Jive Turkey said:
The guy who led the broncos to be 31st in the league in passing?
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Yeah, he completes like 4 passes a game but they're always at the precise moment they need to be completed. Hence divine intervention. Or maybe it's a fix, I dunno.

Personally, I think Bill Maher is an asshole and would rather dedicate my time discussing someone who isn't, but I couldn't blame any of you guys for wanting to get this back on topic.
 
LemonMelon said:
Yeah, he completes like 4 passes a game but they're always at the precise moment they need to be completed. Hence divine intervention. Or maybe it's a fix, I dunno.
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Or dumb luck. Or maybe his teammates should be getting the credit instead of God.

The only reason they're at the precise moments is because he fucked up all the passes at the beginning of the game and put his team in a horrible situation.

Maher and Tebow should have a baby. That would even everything out. Meboher the Level Headed

For the record, I mostly like what Maher says, he just chooses to say it in such a douchey way. Religulous is a great documentary, though
 
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