Atheism - Page 11 - U2 Feedback

Go Back   U2 Feedback > Lypton Village > Free Your Mind
Click Here to Login
Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread Display Modes
 
Old 02-11-2010, 03:36 PM   #151
Blue Crack Addict
 
anitram's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2001
Location: NY
Posts: 16,290
Local Time: 02:00 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by deep View Post
we tell ourselves stories

that is the only truth
__________________

__________________
anitram is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-11-2010, 03:40 PM   #152
Rock n' Roll Doggie
 
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: Strong Badia
Posts: 3,429
Local Time: 07:00 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by deep View Post
we tell ourselves stories

that is the only truth
But some stories have the benefit of being true.
__________________

__________________
nathan1977 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-11-2010, 03:41 PM   #153
Blue Crack Supplier
 
Irvine511's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2003
Location: Washington, DC
Posts: 30,492
Local Time: 02:00 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by nathan1977 View Post
But some stories have the benefit of being true.


if that is what you want to tell yourself.
__________________
Irvine511 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-11-2010, 03:43 PM   #154
Galeonbroad
 
Galeongirl's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: Schoo Fishtank
Posts: 70,773
Local Time: 08:00 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Irvine511 View Post
many of the posts in here become good arguments for atheism, intended or not.
This thread is awesome to read though, if only I had popcorn it'd be even better.

Please keep going guys!
__________________
Quote:
Originally Posted by GraceRyan View Post
And if U2 EVER did Hawkmoon live....and the version from the Lovetown Tour, my uterus would leave my body and fling itself at Bono - for realz.
Don't worry baby, it's gonna be all right. Uncertainty can be a guiding light...
Galeongirl is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-11-2010, 04:06 PM   #155
Blue Crack Addict
 
PhilsFan's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: Standing on the shore, facing east.
Posts: 18,882
Local Time: 02:00 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by nathan1977 View Post
And a year ago my wife and I miscarried.

I understand the emotion behind this. I really do. At the same time, it's not like the world gets any better if you remove God from it. So, like I said before, maybe suffering doesn't prove the absence of God. Maybe God is found in the hands that pull people alive from the Haitian rubble long after they're supposed to be dead.
There are a lot of things that can be improved if God was removed from them.
__________________
PhilsFan is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-11-2010, 04:08 PM   #156
Blue Crack Addict
 
PhilsFan's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: Standing on the shore, facing east.
Posts: 18,882
Local Time: 02:00 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by nathan1977 View Post
Not if you were there.
I don't have to be there to know you're story telling. Just like I don't have to have been there in Biblical times to know the Bible's filled with story telling.
__________________
PhilsFan is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-11-2010, 04:09 PM   #157
Blue Crack Addict
 
PhilsFan's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: Standing on the shore, facing east.
Posts: 18,882
Local Time: 02:00 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by nathan1977 View Post
But some stories have the benefit of being true.
Truth is subjective.

But you're being difficult or you're being delusional. I'm still not sure which.
__________________
PhilsFan is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-11-2010, 04:09 PM   #158
Rock n' Roll Doggie
 
BEAL's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2000
Location: San Diego
Posts: 3,577
Local Time: 07:00 AM
I think humans have a tendancy to try and fill in gaps of the unknown.

Take your friend's crooked legs or back. Your story may very well be true, and doctors could not explain how they were cured or feeling better......but that doesn't mean jesus christ or whatever God you believe in cured them.

it's just that whatever it is, hasn't been found yet. We're so scared of the unknown that in order to make ourselves feel better, we find comfort knowing that some creator/being is watching over us.

You can bet those doctors were going to present those cases of "unknown healings" onwards to be studied and proven. Cause that's the honest thing to do.

Just saying God healed me is a very lazy way of resolving something that you can't explain. It's a damn good thing most of our jobs/societies don't function this way.
__________________
BEAL is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-11-2010, 04:17 PM   #159
Refugee
 
toscano's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2005
Posts: 2,032
Local Time: 12:00 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by BEAL View Post
I think humans have a tendancy to try and fill in gaps of the unknown.

Take your friend's crooked legs or back. Your story may very well be true, and doctors could not explain how they were cured or feeling better......but that doesn't mean jesus christ or whatever God you believe in cured them.

it's just that whatever it is, hasn't been found yet. We're so scared of the unknown that in order to make ourselves feel better, we find comfort knowing that some creator/being is watching over us.

You can bet those doctors were going to present those cases of "unknown healings" onwards to be studied and proven. Cause that's the honest thing to do.

Just saying God healed me is a very lazy way of resolving something that you can't explain. It's a damn good thing most of our jobs/societies don't function this way.
Bingo. took the words right out of my mouth.

the fact that I personally have no fucking clue as to the origin of life, the universe and everything does NOT therefore mean that the bible's version must be true.

As smart as humanity is right now, it still does NOT have the answers to a lot of shit, and all things medical in nature have not yet been fully understood.
__________________
toscano is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-11-2010, 04:18 PM   #160
Rock n' Roll Doggie
 
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: Strong Badia
Posts: 3,429
Local Time: 07:00 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by PhilsFan View Post
Truth is subjective.
Okay. I don't believe you exist.

But nonetheless...
__________________
nathan1977 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-11-2010, 04:20 PM   #161
Blue Crack Addict
 
PhilsFan's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: Standing on the shore, facing east.
Posts: 18,882
Local Time: 02:00 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by nathan1977 View Post
Okay. I don't believe you exist.

But nonetheless...
You're intentionally missing the point.

My point is that your truth isn't really a truth, it's just something you made up in your mind to comfort yourself. I've no idea why you've done this.

I think it's totally irrational, irresponsible, and disrespectful to the medical professionals who undoubtedly aided your friend and healed him.
__________________
PhilsFan is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-11-2010, 04:37 PM   #162
BVS
Blue Crack Supplier
 
BVS's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2002
Location: between my head and heart
Posts: 40,684
Local Time: 01:00 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by nathan1977 View Post
No. In at least two occasions, they went to the doctors the next day, who were confounded.
Why were they going to the doctor if no modern medicine was being used or needed?
__________________
BVS is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-11-2010, 04:41 PM   #163
Refugee
 
toscano's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2005
Posts: 2,032
Local Time: 12:00 AM
Does the fact that they were confounded mean that it automatically was PRAYER that did it ?

Some things just can't be explained with the amount of limited understanding we have of our world at the moment.

You know, centuries ago it wasn't prayer that kept ships from falling off the edge of the world..........(psst....it was knowledge they didn't yet have)
__________________
toscano is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-11-2010, 05:02 PM   #164
Blue Crack Supplier
 
Irvine511's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2003
Location: Washington, DC
Posts: 30,492
Local Time: 02:00 AM
there's no question that prayer and meditation can have untold positive effects on the individual, and there are links between mind/body that are continually being discovered. however, to say that "prayer works" = "existence of a deity" is not correct, and that precisely is putting a narrative over something we don't yet understand.

also, let's not forget about this:

Parents in Prayer Death Get 6 Months in Jail - ABC News

i don't think that anyone is advocating this approach to healing at all, and i also don't think it's entirely fair to dismiss the positive things that spiritual practice can offer to those who are sick and suffering.
__________________
Irvine511 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-11-2010, 05:17 PM   #165
Blue Crack Supplier
 
Irvine511's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2003
Location: Washington, DC
Posts: 30,492
Local Time: 02:00 AM
and, apologies, i mean this light-heartedly, but i can't help but post this:

Quote:
Prayers Answered By Random Series Of Events In Cold, Uncaring Universe

KATY, TX—A man in danger of losing his home had his prayers coincidentally answered Tuesday by the haphazard machinations of an indifferent and entirely random universe. Marvin Pewter, 45, was able to refinance his house after a radio station in Sioux Falls, SD played the favorite song of a local data-entry worker who, quietly singing along to the tune in her office, became distracted and missed a keystroke that eventually resulted in Pewter's credit rating increasing by 200 points. "Thank God," said Pewter, speaking to reporters from the large ranch-style home he purchased four years ago and has never been able to afford. "This just goes to show that, if you put your faith in the Lord, the Lord will provide." At press time, when gale-force winds had leveled his house and swept away all his possessions, Pewter put the blame on atmospheric conditions off the Gulf Coast and declined comment on whether God was punishing him for his hubris.
__________________

__________________
Irvine511 is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off



All times are GMT -5. The time now is 02:00 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8 Beta 1
Copyright ©2000 - 2017, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
Design, images and all things inclusive copyright © Interference.com