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Old 08-30-2012, 08:30 PM   #196
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INDY, so you seem to be unbothered by Paul Ryan's blatant lies?
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Old 08-30-2012, 10:14 PM   #197
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Originally Posted by anitram View Post
INDY, so you seem to be unbothered by Paul Ryan's blatant lies?
If by blatant lies you mean intentionally twisted interpretations, yes, I'm unbothered.

Ryan and His Panicky Critics - James C. Capretta - National Review Online

(edited by me)
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These criticisms of Ryan’s speech are absurd. Everything Ryan said is factual and a fair reading of the record and prior events.

First, it is said that Ryan’s own budget cut Medicare by the same amount. But the Ryan budget not only repealed all of Obamacare’s spending, it also doesn’t specify the kinds of Medicare cuts Obamacare does: It calls for the same level of savings but doesn’t spend the money elsewhere and leaves room for Congress to pursue those savings in ways that don’t rely on price controls and the elimination of benefits.

Ryan’s critics are also up in arms over his mention of the closed GM plant in Janesville, Wis. They claim that Ryan blamed President Obama for the closing of the plant — but Ryan explicitly said that the plant was already closing when then-candidate Obama came to Janesville in 2008: “We were about to lose a major factory,” Ryan said last night.

But let’s step back and look at Ryan’s larger point. He was making the argument that, even with the Obama bailout, the Obama economy is so bad that the plant is still closed and, what’s worse, there’s no prospect that other vibrant industries will take its place. That’s absolutely a fair indictment of the Obama record, especially so because Obama went to the plant and promised hope and change in 2008.

Then there is the business of the U.S. credit downgrade and the Bowles-Simpson commission. Ryan pinned S&P’s decision to lower the credit rating for debt issued by the U.S. government on the president’s failure to lead on fiscal matters, and chastised him specifically for appointing the Bowles-Simpson commission and then doing nothing with the commission’s recommendations. Ryan’s critics say he is being hypocritical because Ryan himself also opposed the Bowles-Simpson recommendations.

But when Ryan opposed that plan (because it left in place Obamacare’s massive new entitlement spending), he proposed an alternative and passed it through the House of Representatives. What did President Obama do? Nothing. He appointed the commission to buy time during the 2010 campaign season, and then, in 2011, decided that leading on the deficit wasn’t in his political interest. So he proposed no plan of his own. And then when Ryan proposed his plan to actually head off a fiscal crisis, the president attacked it in the most partisan and demagogic terms possible. Is it any surprise, with this kind of behavior from the president, that the parties weren’t able to come to an amicable agreement? Any fair reading of the record shows that the president has abdicated his leadership responsibilities on fiscal matters. He richly deserves the blame for the downgrade.

Paul Ryan’s acceptance speech was a tour de force, and a clear success. One measure of that success is the intensity and emptiness of the attacks coming his way. The irony is that these attacks — intended to damage Ryan by undermining his credibility — are more likely to be seen by the electorate for what they really are: desperate and dishonest tactics from those willing to say and do anything to hang on to power.
Anything but a discussion of this president's economic record right? Anything but a discussion of his dismal failure to lead this country back to fiscal sanity.
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Old 08-30-2012, 10:33 PM   #198
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The first thing a cult does is tell you everyone else is lying.

So, thanks for the dispatch from the Fox bubble. It's like listening to the Patty Hearst tapes.
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Old 08-30-2012, 10:41 PM   #199
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I LOVED that. The fact that they couldn't figure out the contradiction in what they were saying was truly stunning.

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But what the poor really need is opportunity, for better-paying jobs and mobility up the wage scale.
Can't argue with this. So are we going to get a proposal for such things from the Republicans that doesn't involve trickle-down economics and tax cuts for the rich (er, excuse me, "job creators")?
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Old 08-30-2012, 10:47 PM   #200
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Originally Posted by INDY500 View Post
If by blatant lies you mean intentionally twisted interpretations, yes, I'm unbothered.
Good to know for next time you go around blasting people for truthiness.
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Old 08-30-2012, 10:51 PM   #201
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The first thing a cult does is tell you everyone else is lying.
Wouldn't that include all political parties?
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Old 08-30-2012, 11:05 PM   #202
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But what's got me very worried today is the blatant acceptance of post-truthiness that one feels creeping deeply into our national debate. Most -- not all -- of the news stories on the speeches from the convention -- and I'm sure this won't be limited to the Republicans -- focus on the emotional, the personal stories, the strategic (did the speech accomplish its goal...did is rally the base... did it appeal to [interest group]?), the political horse race.
And then there's this other section of the show or the newspaper-if you're lucky or interested in going there -- that asks... um... how much of what you just heard was true?
Think about this for a second. Just the fact that newspapers now need a fact-check section is itself evidence that we're deep into the post-truth era. There's the news... and then there's the question of how much of the news is true.
Jared Bernstein: America, We Have a Problem


It is sad that nothing can be trusted - the government, the media, even book authors have to be closely examined to understand where they are coming from in order to determine if what they wrote is factual. There is no real journalism anymore, its all PR, marketing and basic BS. At the same time, its all a big war - minus the violence - for power.

But hey, its human nature. Propaganda is nothing new, its always been there. It just feels so crushing these days because we're surrounded by the media these days - TV, the internet, Twitter, etc.
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Old 08-30-2012, 11:06 PM   #203
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I've been doing my patriotic duty by watching Football and missed the apparently strange Clint Eastwood speech. From what I'm reading, they'd have been better off having the Reagan hologram
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Old 08-30-2012, 11:08 PM   #204
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Originally Posted by Irvine511 View Post
The first thing a cult does is tell you everyone else is lying.

So, thanks for the dispatch from the Fox bubble.
The Fox bubble, so unlike the objective, non-partisan New Republic bubble you posted from on the previous page.

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It's like listening to the Patty Hearst tapes.
Patty's Marxist, anti-American rants were the result of being kidnapped and brainwashed by the Symbionese Liberation Army at the age of 19.

What's your excuse?
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Old 08-30-2012, 11:19 PM   #205
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I'm about 30 minutes behind on my dvr

Romney's entrance was good, very much like a SOTU entrance.

I have never been a Rubio fan, But I will say I was impressed with his speaking ability, Probably one to watch.

Romney's best advocates, have been everyone else. He seems like a much more decent and capable person than what he comes across as when he is speaking. I really think he does not like to toot his own horn.
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Old 08-30-2012, 11:22 PM   #206
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Oh and hear there was a Code Pink protester. That isn't the time or place for a protest.
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Old 08-30-2012, 11:23 PM   #207
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Romney and the GOP need to bowl a perfect game to win. No margin for error.

I think it is possible for them to win. This has been a very good convention for the GOP.

If Romney pulls a rabbit out of the hat and wins, he will owe a part of that success to John Stewart and his lemmings.
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Old 08-30-2012, 11:36 PM   #208
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Originally Posted by INDY500

The Fox bubble, so unlike the objective, non-partisan New Republic bubble you posted from on the previous page.

Dude, Ryan's lies were homepage news this morning across most media outlets including Fox News, as was posted in here this morning.

Sensing distress among the ranks, the NRO dispatched its hacks to get to work and give people such as yourself something to hold on to.
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Old 08-30-2012, 11:58 PM   #209
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Jon Huntsman was just interviewed on Colbert's show.

Why can't he be the face of the GOP? I'd listen to him.
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Old 08-31-2012, 12:11 AM   #210
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I'll also add that I read The Corner frequently (NRO's opinion page) Soni well know from whence INDY posts.

Kathryn Jean Lopez is absolutely unmissable. Her post today about "Ryan at prayer" has to be read to be believed.

And remember, these are the people who will tell you the truth. No one else. The rest of the media is liberal and they lie.
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