will SOA be as good as NLOTH

[Niceman]

If there is a Best Of 2000-2010, I'd say there is an 80% chance of Winter finding a home there. Cynical though I may seem regarding U2, I doubt there will be one, but I think that possibility (even taking into account the longshot of U2 dedicating a compilation to three albums) is far greater than U2 recycling the song once more for an album with a supposedly fleshed out lyrical theme. Or any album, for that matter.

#1 I'd estimate there is maybe a 20% chance of their even being a Best of 2000-2010 album.

#2 A song which has never seen commercial release, which they are working on a final version of still can hardly be called "recycled."

#3 I'm yet to hear any plausible theory as to why Winter wasn't on the Brothers Soundtrack except for my own; that they wanted to save it for the album.

#4 I think we can assume that the 1 year old news that SOA would have a supposed lyrical running theme (To the extent people imagine Bono meant) are doubtful at this date, to say the least... The odds are that whatever album we get this year will be 50% songs they had a year ago, at most!

 

[LemonMelon]

#4 I think we can assume that the 1 year old news that SOA would have a supposed lyrical running theme (To the extent people imagine Bono meant) are doubtful at this date, to say the least... The odds are that whatever album we get this year will be 50% songs they had a year ago, at most!

On this we actually agree, to some extent. Only I believe Winter will be part of the 50% axed. If you could even consider Winter a leftover at this point.

 

[Niceman]

On this we actually agree, to some extent. Only I believe Winter will be part of the 50% axed. If you could even consider Winter a leftover at this point.

Ok. So then give me a plausible theory as to why Winter wasn't released with Brothers? And how do you account for the fact that Edge has said he's working on a third electronic version of it now?

 

[LemonMelon]

Ok. So then give me a plausible theory as to why Winter wasn't released with Brothers? And how do you account for the fact that Edge has said he's working on a third electronic version of it now?

It WAS released with Brothers. People can see the movie and hear it at their leisure. How is the soundtrack even relevant anyway? The key is the attention the song attracts, and it attracted far too much for U2 to be bothering with it again. There is not one existing example of U2 specifically recording a song for a movie/musical (Stay and UTEOTW come to mind, but the circumstances are immeasurably different), only for it to wind up on a U2 album. Why Edge has chosen to tinker with it further may come down to either Brian Wilsonian obsession or (more likely) creative satisfaction. Artists do that sometimes.

 

[Niceman]

It WAS released with Brothers. People can see the movie and hear it at their leisure. How is the soundtrack even relevant anyway? The key is the attention the song attracts, and it attracted far too much for U2 to be bothering with it again. There is not one existing example of U2 specifically recording a song for a movie/musical (Stay and UTEOTW come to mind, but the circumstances are immeasurably different), only for it to wind up on a U2 album. Why Edge has chosen to tinker with it further may come down to either Brian Wilsonian obsession or (more likely) creative satisfaction. Artists do that sometimes.

There is NO example of U2 taking the time to write and record a song to have it appear in a movie and not make it available for purchase in any form. And really, I can't think of any major band having ever done that either!

If you really do find your own argument half-way plausible, good luck with that. I don't.

 

[BVS]

There is NO example of U2 taking the time to write and record a song to have it appear in a movie and not make it available for purchase in any form. And really, I can't think of any major band having ever done that either!

If you really do find your own argument half-way plausible, good luck with that. I don't.

I agree it's weird, but I'm still not sold it will be on the next album... I just don't think they think it's all that

Maybe a Winter EP released right before the tour start? I would say we have a better chance of that than it showing up on the next full album.

If I was a betting man...

 

[Galeongirl]

Linear is a movie, and so is Brothers, but I think it is obvious that U2 has never written a song for a movie without also making a version of the song available for purchase in sonic format. And I can't imagine any incentive for them ever doing so.

The fact that the song is up for awards should make this point all the more obvious.

And what is a movie? Indeed, a commercial product. You said it has not been commercially released.


I really don't get why you're so incredibly anal about this. You're seeing things, there's no big paranoia plot putting Winter aside. Really.

 

[LemonMelon]

There is NO example of U2 taking the time to write and record a song to have it appear in a movie and not make it available for purchase in any form. And really, I can't think of any major band having ever done that either!

If you really do find your own argument half-way plausible, good luck with that. I don't.

Give it time. Winter will find its way onto a compilation of some kind or, as BVS mentioned, perhaps a digital release/EP. Just not SOA.

 

[Niceman]

And what is a movie? Indeed, a commercial product. You said it has not been commercially released.


I really don't get why you're so incredibly anal about this. You're seeing things, there's no big paranoia plot putting Winter aside. Really.

Anal? I don't think that's the word you mean to use. Willful? Stubborn? Seriously, no one has given me another plausible theory as to why the song wasn't released. It's laughable to suggest that the studio couldn't afford the price U2 asked for the song to put it on the album after they paid to have it in the movie, and no one has suggested anything else!

And please, don't play games and tell me that you don't know there is a fundamental difference between a song being released and a song being in a movie. Yes, you can buy the movie and you COULD stick it in your DVD player and find the right scene when the time comes that you want to hear it, but no one does this. No one has to, because major bands don't release songs in movies that they don't also release in their own right.

Actually, you're the one being "Anal" by playing around with the technical-at-best point that a song which appears in a movie is TECHNICALLY released, even though you know there is a tremendous difference between the two.

Also, I don't recall suggesting there was a plot -a paranoid one or not - around the song. Who's seeing things? The band has said that they are still working on the song! I just suggested there was a plan!

 

[Niceman]

I agree it's weird, but I'm still not sold it will be on the next album... I just don't think they think it's all that

Maybe a Winter EP released right before the tour start? I would say we have a better chance of that than it showing up on the next full album.

If I was a betting man...

Well, they must believe in it to some extent, as they are working up another version of the song!

NOT gonna start the whole EP debate again here.....lol! I'm already being called anal and paranoid just for saying that U2 didn't spend all of the time they spent on Winter just to have it appear in a movie and not available in its own right!

 

[mikal]

i think we're gonna get an EP.

 

[BVS]

I'm not sure we can take Bono's comment about overhearing Edge playing an electronic version, as a serious "we know the band is working on another version". He may have just been tinkering around...

I think U2 has finally realized the huge difference in the industry as far as sales that has occured since the release of Bomb. I think maybe they thought they were immune but now have realized otherwise, so anything is possible.

 

[Niceman]

i think we're gonna get an EP.

I think your Mother is gonna get an EP!

 

[Niceman]

I'm not sure we can take Bono's comment about overhearing Edge playing an electronic version, as a serious "we know the band is working on another version". He may have just been tinkering around...

I think U2 has finally realized the huge difference in the industry as far as sales that has occured since the release of Bomb. I think maybe they thought they were immune but now have realized otherwise, so anything is possible.

Yeah, anything can happen..... but as far as what we think is MOST LIKELY?

I say Winter gets released in some form. Being on the new album seems the most likely place to me.

And I don't think U2 releases an EP.

 

[The_acrobat]

i think we're gonna get an EP.

At this point, I'd be very happy to have an EP. We all know well and good that if U2 do not release an album before June, most of these songs will be scrapped by the time they do go back to working on the next album, whenever that may be. So instead of wasting all the work they're currently doing, why not release the best 5 or 6 on an EP? They could make a little bit more money, give the fans something to chew on, as well as something else to draw from in their setlists.

Sounds simple to me. But maybe it's not that simple at all.

 

[Mrs. Garrison]

i think we're fucked

 

[LemonMelon]

Obviously, if this thread managed to reach 6 pages.

 

[daygloeyes2]

i think we're gonna get an EP.

you're an EP!!!!!!

 

[nielsgov]

i think we're fucked

Best post of the thread...

 

[U2girl]

#3 I'm yet to hear any plausible theory as to why Winter wasn't on the Brothers Soundtrack except for my own; that they wanted to save it for the album.

I'm yet to hear a plausible theory as to why Winter will be on SOA other than the fact that it wasn't on the official Brothers soundtrack. (it is played after the credits, and after being included on Linear).

 

[Niceman]

I'm yet to hear a plausible theory as to why Winter will be on SOA other than the fact that it wasn't on the official Brothers soundtrack. (it is played after the credits, and after being included on Linear).

Ok. Here's my reasoning:

#1 U2 care about the song. Brian Eno even publicly insulted them for not daring to put it on NLOTH. Corbijn fought to get to keep it on Linear.
#2 It is up for awards
#3 It is really unprecidented for U2 to write a song for a movie and not include the song on that album's soundtrack. I safely assume there was SOME reason, rather than they just forgot.
#4 We have been led to believe that SOA will be the second half of a pair of linked albums and include some tracks that didn't quite get put on NLOTH.
#5 Winter wasn't even released as a B-side or digital track even though it was featured in 2 movies. U2 want us to know about the song, but not to buy it yet.

Look, I'm not claiming to KNOW the track listing of SOA. I am saying that there is good and solid reason to think there is a better than 50% chance that Winter will be there.

Have I said anything implausible? I really can't imagine what..... And I don't understand what is implausible about the claim that the song having not been musically released yet suggests they might have another home in mind for it....

 

[U2girl]

#1 Yes, but this does not prove Winter is up for SOA.
#2 Does this influence SOA tracklist in any way ?
#3 Still a part of the movie even if it didn't make the soundtrack. Maybe it was a late/last minute addition to the movie. U2 said they saw the movie and then wrote the song.
#4 True. We were also told WAS and Winter were written for Brothers in particular. One made it on NLOTH, the other made it into the movie.
#5 U2 wants the song to be linked with Brothers movie. (Linear version clearly not being the final version)

 

[Niceman]

#1 Yes, but this does not prove Winter is up for SOA.
#2 Does this influence SOA tracklist in any way ?
#3 Still a part of the movie even if it didn't make the soundtrack. Maybe it was a late/last minute addition to the movie. U2 said they saw the movie and then wrote the song.
#4 True. We were also told WAS and Winter were written for Brothers in particular. One made it on NLOTH, the other made it into the movie.
#5 U2 wants the song to be linked with Brothers movie. (Linear version clearly not being the final version)

#1 I didn't say I could prove anything! I am listing a number of reasons which together make it, in my opinion, more than 51% likely...
#2 I dunno. It might. That's the thing about having 5 or so reasons that you suspect something. They add up to greater than the whole.
#3 No, it wasn't last minute. We know they had the song before NLOTH was released in March and the movie came out in the fall. If the song really was written for Brothers, they had it MUCH earlier and gave it to Anton when he started work on Linear.
#4 Cool.
#5 I don't understand your response. How does not making the song musically available make it more linked to the movie? It doesn't. I still say that the only likely explanation for the song not being released as music yet is that they want to save it for something....And I'm guessing that that would be their next full-length release.

 

[U2girl]

I mean "last minute" - maybe it was finished too late to make it on the official soundtrack, but not too late to be added in the closing credits.
And it is linked to the movie precisely because more people may see the movie and hear that version compared to amount of people buying the extra edition of NLOTH.

The song is officially available on the special edition of NLOTH, and it is a part of the movie. To have 3 versions of a song out there is completely unprecedented for U2.

 

[ShipOfFools]

My guess is that it will be. NLOTH is a fantastic album, and I think if they keep that spirit, they'll make another great one.

 

[Niceman]

I mean "last minute" - maybe it was finished too late to make it on the official soundtrack, but not too late to be added in the closing credits.
And it is linked to the movie precisely because more people may see the movie and hear that version compared to amount of people buying the extra edition of NLOTH.

The song is officially available on the special edition of NLOTH, and it is a part of the movie. To have 3 versions of a song out there is completely unprecedented for U2.

There is not a single version of the song currently available AS MUSIC. This is completely unprecidented in U2's history, and I can't personally think of any major band that does that sort of thing. It's kinda like throwing money away. (And U2 doesn't have a history of that.)

I doubt U2 failed to do their homework and missed some deadline to get the song on the album. You're REALLY stretching here.

EDIT: Also, let me add, more people will buy U2s next album than will go and see Brothers - let alone sit through the credits! (And there is no such thing as an "extra edition" of NLOTH.)

 

[LemonMelon]

#3 No, it wasn't last minute. We know they had the song before NLOTH was released in March and the movie came out in the fall. If the song really was written for Brothers, they had it MUCH earlier and gave it to Anton when he started work on Linear.

Brothers was delayed a number of times. It was originally slated for a January 2009 release, and was supposed to be our first taste of the NLOTH era. It's entirely plausible that U2 was aware of the film during Winter's conception.

 

[Niceman]

Brothers was delayed a number of times. It was originally slated for a January 2009 release, and it was supposed to be our first taste of the NLOTH era. It's entirely plausible that U2 was aware of the film during Winter's conception.

I do believe them when they say the song was written for the movie. I'm just trying to say there that even if we take the most skeptical position, the song wasn't written last minute.

 

[U2girl]

There is not a single version of the song currently available AS MUSIC. This is completely unprecidented in U2's history, and I can't personally think of any major band that does that sort of thing. It's kinda like throwing money away. (And U2 doesn't have a history of that.)

I doubt U2 failed to do their homework and missed some deadline to get the song on the album. You're REALLY stretching here.

(And there is no such thing as an "extra edition" of NLOTH.)

Yes, there is.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Linear_(film)

I think it's very likely U2 missed some deadline for the movie soundtrack.

 

[Niceman]

Yes, there is.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Linear_(film)

I think it's very likely U2 missed some deadline for the movie soundtrack.

Why did you give me a link to a Wikipedia article on Linear? What does that have to do with anything?

And that's cool. You're free to think U2 missed the deadline as much as you want. (Even though they wrote the song more than a year before the movie came out, and the studio would never throw away the money that increased sales from having a U2 song on it would mean - even if they had to delay the soundtrack for weeks or months.)