Production - JT/AB sound vs. ATYCLB clean sound

The friendliest place on the web for anyone that follows U2.
If you have answers, please help by responding to the unanswered posts.
See posts with no answers
G

gujuju

The Fly
Joined
Nov 15, 2004
Messages
81
Location
NYC
Thinking about the last three Eno/Lanois albums - for the new album would you guys prefer the analog-ish sound of AB/JT or do you prefer the crisp, clean production of ATYCLB?

While clear sound quality is nice, something about the hiss adds makes AB sound more real. JT also feels real, although the production of Streets seems to repress the song a bit (doesn't sound as alive as in concert)

Thoughts?
 
JT and AB are in a completely different universe than their later albums, production-wise.

UF, JT, and AB all definitely sound like they were not recorded in a styrofoam box.
 
gujuju said:
Thinking about the last three Eno/Lanois albums - for the new album would you guys prefer the analog-ish sound of AB/JT or do you prefer the crisp, clean production of ATYCLB?

While clear sound quality is nice, something about the hiss adds makes AB sound more real. JT also feels real, although the production of Streets seems to repress the song a bit (doesn't sound as alive as in concert)

Thoughts?
Click to expand...

so since this thread is about production, what do you guys think, as far as the new album is concerned...will the new album have AB/JT production or ATYCLB/HTDABB....as far as I'm concerned, ATYCLB and HTDABB are in very similar categories production wise....AB/JT sound so much more authentic to me and real than the past 2 albums...it distracts from the actual songs. But anyway, rather than what you prefer, what do you think will be the production style on the next album?

Also, you mention "analog-ish" - that's sort of a thing of the past, isn't it? It seems like we're passed that now, I sure Eno/Lanois and the entire sound/production team are aware of this "anolog-ish" sound on the next album. I personally feel the overall sound on both ATYCLB/HTDAAB is sub-par and less "real" sounding and takes away from the atmosphere the songs could potentially create....I hope the new album steers away from this sound. :pray:
 
gujuju said:
Thinking about the last three Eno/Lanois albums - for the new album would you guys prefer the analog-ish sound of AB/JT or do you prefer the crisp, clean production of ATYCLB?

While clear sound quality is nice, something about the hiss adds makes AB sound more real. JT also feels real, although the production of Streets seems to repress the song a bit (doesn't sound as alive as in concert)

Thoughts?
Click to expand...

I'm not very sure how to judge production. I've always felt U2 albums had excellent production in the sense that there are no noise drops or evidence something went wrong in the recording process. On The Cure albums, I can hear moments when there's no sound in one speaker or a tick -- even as late as the 1992 album "Wish" when the band was well off enough to ensure better production.

I will say that I want more of the Joshua Tree and Achtung Baby's sense of loud and soft to give texture and subtlety to pieces. The 2000 and later albums lack a sense of texture -- everything is pronounced for every note. As a result, so as not to overwhelm the listener, there's more simplification of notes and instruments. I don't think any of this has to do with digital versus analogue, though. Classical music has been recorded in all its subtlety on purely digital formats since the 1970s or 1980s. I have a Housemartins CD that's DDD also. I'm pretty sure Radiohead have always used digital (though I could be wrong) and there's lots of subtlety in the production.

So, JT and AB all the way, but I could do without the hiss. In the remaster for The Cure's "Pornography", Robert eliminated a lot of the hiss that plagued the poor CD release of the album; he'd always said the tape and vinyl were better than what Elektra had released in 1990. The remaster from 2005 sounds much better; less hiss, but no loss of production value.

I'd also add that Streets along with every U2 song post-1983 sounds better on the album. Live is nice but not nearly as subtle or well-performed.
 
I bet U2 have just read this and gone "oh crap!" and then the album is delayed...

:D
 
U2opra said:
I bet U2 have just read this and gone "oh crap!" and then the album is delayed...

:D
Click to expand...

I wish everyone in the studio would read this thread...I mean it might change their way of thinking...maybe...just maybe

but seriously, Eno and Lanois have to know that AB/JT sound is the way to go, right? JT and AB are so much easier on the ears than ATYCLB, how could they make this mistake again. :pray:
 
The reason why JT sounds different from HTDAAB is in the mixing and mastering. Bomb is much more dense with lots of layers, but they're all crowded together. JT is more open and spacious with plenty of room for the instruments to breath. Also, Bomb is mastered so that the volume is louder overall (a trend in all rock the last 8 years or so) and squashes any sublety.

Listen to WOWY and MD back to back for comparison since they're the same chord progression.
 
gujuju said:
Thinking about the last three Eno/Lanois albums - for the new album would you guys prefer the analog-ish sound of AB/JT or do you prefer the crisp, clean production of ATYCLB?

While clear sound quality is nice, something about the hiss adds makes AB sound more real. JT also feels real, although the production of Streets seems to repress the song a bit (doesn't sound as alive as in concert)

Thoughts?
Click to expand...

It's not entirely feasible to compare the sound on U2's older records to the sound on U2's newer records. Audio engineering has changed a lot over the past thirty years or so. For one thing, digital recording technology is used almost exclusively. The days of analogue recording are long gone. Digital recording gives a brighter, clearer sound, but it also takes away a lot of the character. I shudder to think what an album like Dark Side Of The Moon would have sounded like if it was recorded in a modern studio.

Another thing you've got to take into consideration is the "loudness" war. I don't want to spend too much time discussing it, so I'll just direct you to a Wikipedia link: Loudness war - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia. One of the major reasons why AB sounds "real" in comparison to, say, anything on HTDAAB, is that the dynamic range of the recording hasn't been choked. If you have access to any recording software - Audacity is a good one that you can download for free - simply compare the waveforms on older U2 songs to the waveforms on newer U2 songs. Vertigo is a solid block of ugly sound. In God's Country, in comparison, has a great deal of dynamic breathing room.

Vertigo:
goodgod.jpg


In God's Country:
ingodscountry.jpg


In order to hear an album engineered ala JT or AB, we would have to invent a time machine. Digital! Louder! It's the way of the future.
down.gif



Edit:

Rob33 said:
but seriously, Eno and Lanois have to know that AB/JT sound is the way to go, right? JT and AB are so much easier on the ears than ATYCLB, how could they make this mistake again. :pray:
Click to expand...

The state of modern audio engineering is not the fault of Eno or Lanois. It's just the way it is. :sad: Blame the music industry.
 
:hmm:

interesting, GG, thanks for that :up:

so, then...it's pretty safe to say we're going to get another HTDAAB sound on the new record :(

shit.....that was really something I was hoping would change with a better studio team this time around....I guess not :mad:

Edit:
GibsonGirl said:
The state of modern audio engineering is not the fault of Eno or Lanois. It's just the way it is. :sad: Blame the music industry.
Click to expand...

right....ok..haha, I get it...thanks :up:
 
How do Joshua Tree and Achtung Baby sound the same at all? Achtung Baby has the worst production of any U2 album, while Joshua Tree has one of the better productions. Maybe they're not as loud, but Achtung Baby is muddled and blurs out the best part of the album: Edge's guitar, whereas Joshua Tree puts it at the forefront.

These are three totally different sounds, these albums. Achtung Baby is the worst produced album U2 has ever made.
 
Rob33 said:
so, then...it's pretty safe to say we're going to get another HTDAAB sound on the new record :(
Click to expand...

Absolutely. :sigh:

I didn't bother to buy the remastered JT, as I'm of the opinion that there is absolutely nothing wrong with the original master. U2's early albums might benefit a remaster (October in particular), but not if this simply entails an increase in volume. Clear up the sound, yes, but don't max it to the point of making our ears bleed!
 
GibsonGirl said:
I didn't bother to buy the remastered JT, as I'm of the opinion that there is absolutely nothing wrong with the original master. U2's early albums might benefit a remaster (October in particular), but not if this simply entails an increase in volume. Clear up the sound, yes, but don't max it to the point of making our ears bleed!
Click to expand...

so you haven't heard the JT remastered tracks? It's far from just a volume adjustment imo, they really filled in the sound and brought out a lot of what was in the background before, Exit and Mothers Of The Disappeared especially are a revelation now that you can hear them properly.
 
elevated_u2_fan said:
so you haven't heard the JT remastered tracks? It's far from just a volume adjustment imo, they really filled in the sound and brought out a lot of what was in the background before, Exit and Mothers Of The Disappeared especially are a revelation now that you can hear them properly.
Click to expand...

No. I might buy it one day, but I honestly could not be bothered to waste the money on something I've already heard before. I like it that Exit is so quiet on the original master. It's the kind of song you have to crank up on your personal CD player and listen to in the dark. The dynamics really contribute to the feel of it, as far as I'm concerned, and I would hate to hear that changed.
 
to be quite honest I have never been able to understand where producing, mixing and mastering start and end

I guess Joshua Tree goes for a spacious sound, Achtung Baby for a muddled sound and All that you can't .... for clarity
albums ask for a certain sound
I can't imagine any of these albums sounding like the other

in general I prefer clarity
but hey, whatever suits
 
didn't they re-record wave of sorrow? I think that song proves they can still master a spacious sound like ones heard from JT and AB.
 
Muldfeld said:
I'm not very sure how to judge production. I've always felt U2 albums had excellent production in the sense that there are no noise drops or evidence something went wrong in the recording process.
Click to expand...

I'd beg to differ in at least two cases.

1. The beginning of Crumbs From Your Table is full of all sorts of stupid noises that just don't sound right. I'm no expert, but to me this sounds like some of error somewhere, either in the production / mixing / mastering.

2. The whole of AB has a really muddy sound that hides in particular Edge's guitar. This may have been on purpose but when you know the guitar riffs in those songs after having heard them live going back and listening to AB makes you wonder where on earth Edge is in the mix.
 
Achtung Baby sounds horrible. Even Edge admitted that the mixing was botched. It's not some genius step forward; they fucked things up and the songs managed to shine through and touch people anyway. PLEASE don't let the next record have a similar hurdle. :(
 
Of course, if you're referring to decibels, the obvious answer is that quieter is better, because it allows for greater dynamics.

But please mix the damn thing correctly. That's more important to me, honestly. You can crank a song up louder, but it won't do you any good if you're cranking it up to hear the guitar better and it's buried in the mix.
 
Achtung Baby is arguably the worst produced album I've ever heard. I mean, you cannot hear Edge's guitar in numerous cases, and in other ones, it's way too low in the mix.

See:
Zoo Station - Chorus
EBTTRT - Riff (you can only hear half of it)
UTEOTW - Outro (the entire thing is blotted out by random noises, mostly vocal shouting)
The Fly - The end part of the solo is blurred, and the outro has about four guitar parts at once, to the point where it's just a mess.
Mysterious Ways - The guitar is too low in the mix during the chorus.
TTTYAATW - I can't hear any guitar anywhere in the song.
LIB - Edge's outro solo is barely audible behind Bono just yelling "doo doo do-doo."

It's fucking painful how good it could have been and wasn't.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.

Similar threads

LemonMelon
Desert Island XI - QUARANTINE ISLAND - Group 2 Listening Thread
4 5 6
Replies
175
Views
6K
namkcuR
N
LemonMelon
Desert Island XI - QUARANTINE ISLAND - Group 1 Listening Thread
7 8 9
Replies
244
Views
7K
LemonMelon
LemonMelon
jphelmet
I+E vs JT vs E+I Which Tour is Best?
2
Replies
39
Views
7K
Martinski
M
LemonMelon
Desert Island XI - QUARANTINE ISLAND - Master List and Discussion Thread
4 5 6
Replies
175
Views
5K
Axver
Axver
A
The Little stranger chapter 1
Replies
0
Views
983
annj
A

Latest posts

Back
Top Bottom