Eno / Rubin Comments in March issue of Q Mag

[U2Man]

if eno works with u2 again, they're just trying to copy coldplay.

 

[love2bmama]

this was my desktop for a while...I'm married to a chef so it seemed appropriate

 

[Lancemc]

Thanks alot. Cool stuff. I wonder if anyone has more photos from this specific shoot...and maybe in bigger resolution.

 

[cg]

^^ you know that photo request is a job for pleba at this point ... right ??

 

[biff]

He gets synth credit on several songs on ATYCLB. If he contributed something major to any of the songs, yes he should be credited. (if it's beyond production duties or playing a synth part, that is)

It's surprising that after UF, Zooropa, JT and AB there were no such issues. What was so different on ATYCLB?

I think ATYCLB is different in one very signicant way. During the making of that record Bono was absent, as we know, a great deal of the time, and was unable to contribute as much to the creative process day to day. I would not be at all surprised that Eno to a larger extent filled that creative gap, and thus did indeed contribute more to the writing on that record.

 

[Irvine511]

for whatever it's worth, and i know this sounds dubious coming from some dude over the internet, but i do know someone who is friends with Lanois, and apparently Lanois and the band had a bit of a falling out during ATYCLB. the friend said that, yes, Lanois and Bono remain friends, but Bono can be extremely difficult, and it shouldn't take anyone 2 years to record an album, as Lanois was nearly crazy by the end. they've since reconciled, of course, but it appears as if the making of that record was so difficult that neither Eno nor Lanois wanted to be around for the next.

 

[LemonMelon]

I make it no secret that I dislike the production on many of the albums Eno was involved with, particularly Achtung Baby, so I can't say I'll lose any sleep if the Eno/Lanois team refuses to work with the band further. However, their effect on the band's songwriting is untold. They may have helped the band pen countless classics, and this is an outlet I do not want them to lose.

 

[U2girl]

I think ATYCLB is different in one very signicant way. During the making of that record Bono was absent, as we know, a great deal of the time, and was unable to contribute as much to the creative process day to day. I would not be at all surprised that Eno to a larger extent filled that creative gap, and thus did indeed contribute more to the writing on that record.

I guess we'll never know what really happened. He has a point if he really contributed to the songwriting, a la Passengers, but if his work didn't stretch beyond usual producing/mixing/synth playing...

It's possible that they - U2 and Eno and/or Lanois - got into disagreements as ATYCLB took a long time to make. That said, it's noticeable that Lanois was called in for that infamous week in the fall of 2003 before Lillywhite got on board, and AFAIK Eno wasn't working on Bomb.

It seems that things are all reconciled now, and Eno does state they will most likely work again. I don't mind the band stepping away from the Eno/Lanois shadow for a bit, I don't think they are a must for a very good/classic U2 album and ATYCLB isn't better than the previous U2/Eno/Lanois collaborations.

 

[Swan269]

for whatever it's worth, and i know this sounds dubious coming from some dude over the internet, but i do know someone who is friends with Lanois, and apparently Lanois and the band had a bit of a falling out during ATYCLB. the friend said that, yes, Lanois and Bono remain friends, but Bono can be extremely difficult, and it shouldn't take anyone 2 years to record an album, as Lanois was nearly crazy by the end. they've since reconciled, of course, but it appears as if the making of that record was so difficult that neither Eno nor Lanois wanted to be around for the next.

Lanois did come back for the 'bomb' and give the band some feedback about the album so the fallout couldn't have been that awful.

 

[doctorwho]

I think ATYCLB is different in one very signicant way. During the making of that record Bono was absent, as we know, a great deal of the time, and was unable to contribute as much to the creative process day to day. I would not be at all surprised that Eno to a larger extent filled that creative gap, and thus did indeed contribute more to the writing on that record.

I disagree. Bono's contribution are lyrics and the melody. He often does this part outside of the studio anyway. The rest of the band works on the music. Note that the melody Bono sings doesn't match the music (like a church song). Bono may say to have a "slower love song" or "airplanes soaring" or whatever, to get the overall feel for a song. Once the basic music is done, then Bono starts to come in with a general melody and basic lyrics. Not only have we read that this is true, but it's also evident from the "Salome" bootleg.

In other words, Eno's contribution was most likely musical. But how much? For example, didn't Eno play the synths on "Streets"? But was he fully responsible for that part? Not per the credits.

It is, as so many wrote, a fine line. U2, however, do seem very good at acknowledging everyone. If Edge contributes to lyrics, it is listed, for example. Therefore, until I see more proof otherwise, I have to side with the band here. They've worked with Eno many times, they have proven that they are good at crediting people, so... In other words, to make that sort of statement puts the burden of proof on Eno. Based on McGuinness' comments, it could have been more about $$, even if Eno denies it.

Lastly, from my understanding of ATYCLB, Eno was NOT in the studio that much either - perhaps far less than Bono! From what I've read, Lanois was there most days, and Eno would come in to "fine tune" the work and make suggestions. Therefore, if anyone should be making such a claim, it could be Lanois. Yet, he seems perfectly content.

 

[Aygo]

^ Ditto. Agree with this.

 

[caragriff]

I disagree. Bono's contribution are lyrics and the melody. He often does this part outside of the studio anyway. The rest of the band works on the music. Note that the melody Bono sings doesn't match the music (like a church song). Bono may say to have a "slower love song" or "airplanes soaring" or whatever, to get the overall feel for a song. Once the basic music is done, then Bono starts to come in with a general melody and basic lyrics. Not only have we read that this is true, but it's also evident from the "Salome" bootleg.

on the salome bootleg i remember hearing bono telling adam and larry how to play.

on the rattle and hum dvd outtakes i remember seeing bono and edge writing songs together on the porch.

on the UF documentray i remember seeing bono at the control board with eno.

i remember bono and edge explaining how they wrote crumbs together one night after drinking too much.

point: when U2 are at their, IMO, most interesting, bono is definitely heavily involved in the songwriting. hell, even for window in the skies bono claims it started with a bono piano melody ...

 

[Aygo]

i remember bono and edge explaining how they wrote crumbs together one night after drinking too much.

I don't know why, but I never believed in this story... Can't explain why, maybe because of the way it was told...

 

[AtomicBono]

Anyone noticed the notes on the next album release date in the last paragraph from the page with Rubin's comments ? 2009?!?

yeah but that was basically just basing it on how long they took to make Bomb. Pretty much said 2008 was most likely, while 2007 was overly optimistic.

point: when U2 are at their, IMO, most interesting, bono is definitely heavily involved in the songwriting. hell, even for window in the skies bono claims it started with a bono piano melody ...

U2 is all over the place. Edge can come up with basslines, Larry can come up with a chord progression, hell, Bono could come up with a cool drum part. It's well documented that they don't always stick to their defined roles when it comes to songwriting. so I'm sure Bono does more than lyrics and melody writing.

as for Eno... I don't know, the interview says he was less involved in ATYCLB, yet he now demands songwriting credits? seems sort of strange.

 

[BEAL]

I will agree with the opinion of when U2 are at their best, Bono is around.

I know we read interviews where the band says they're actually better without him. We've also read in numerous articles and books that Bono can be the biggest pain in the studio.

I personally think Bono represents U2's creative side. Of course you can lump Edge in there too, but Bono is as far left as you can get. Larry and Adam are the two that kind of balance it all out.

I hope that the next album Bono will be around much more. In one article, he stated that he really wants to spend this year getting lost in the music again. I hope that happens.

I adore the past 2 albums because I take them for what they are, and that's a collection of songs by 4 men playing in a room. If the next album is the same I just hope the songs are good.

If I had a complaint, it'd be the lyrics. A little too direct for my liking. So maybe we'll get back to a more poetic sytle.

I kind of wish the article was a little more telling in regards to Rubin. Will they work together? Sounds likely, but you never know. The way I understood it was U2 will be working on songs on their own, then present them to Rubin later in the year.

 

[Reggie Thee Dog]

I, for one, will not be disappointed if Eno stays behind and Rubin commands the control on the next album.

As much as I appreciate Eno's contribution to the band, it's time to move on to something different. Whether it be harder, softer or more 'Pop' let's have Rubin give it the old college try.

 

[XHendrix24]

Why would BRIAN ENO lie about something like songwriting credits, especially after all this time of working with the band? I don't think there's any reason to believe that he's lying, other than "Bono's the greatest and never lies so Eno must be a moneygrubbing attention-whore."

He's BRIAN ENO. GAH.

It's not uncommon at all for Eno to help compose songs on artists' albums that he's heavily involved in. For example, Talking Heads' Remain in Light. I just don't think there's any reason to believe that he's lying. It's not like he's even making a big deal out of it. He brought it up in an obscure magazine interview some 7 years AFTER the album was released. And he doesn't even mention any desire for money (not like he needs money anyway - once again, he's fucking Brian Eno).

 

[Aygo]

Why would BRIAN ENO lie about something like songwriting credits, especially after all this time of working with the band? I don't think there's any reason to believe that he's lying, other than "Bono's the greatest and never lies so Eno must be a moneygrubbing attention-whore."

He's BRIAN ENO. GAH.

It's not uncommon at all for Eno to help compose songs on artists' albums that he's heavily involved in. For example, Talking Heads' Remain in Light. I just don't think there's any reason to believe that he's lying. It's not like he's even making a big deal out of it. He brought it up in an obscure magazine interview some 7 years AFTER the album was released. And he doesn't even mention any desire for money (not like he needs money anyway - once again, he's fucking Brian Eno).

Yeah, but being Eno doesn't justify anything...

 

[rihannsu]

Why would BRIAN ENO lie about something like songwriting credits, especially after all this time of working with the band? I don't think there's any reason to believe that he's lying, other than "Bono's the greatest and never lies so Eno must be a moneygrubbing attention-whore."

He's BRIAN ENO. GAH.

It's not uncommon at all for Eno to help compose songs on artists' albums that he's heavily involved in. For example, Talking Heads' Remain in Light. I just don't think there's any reason to believe that he's lying. It's not like he's even making a big deal out of it. He brought it up in an obscure magazine interview some 7 years AFTER the album was released. And he doesn't even mention any desire for money (not like he needs money anyway - once again, he's fucking Brian Eno).

I would be willing to bet that Eno simply assumed he would be credited for a greater contribution without ever talking to the band about wanting credit. There may very well have been a difference to the way the worked together due to having done Passengers where the band clearly stated that Eno was an equal or greater contributor. It could be that he thought they would credit him but they simply assumed the previous U2 relationship. I know most people seem to consider Passengers as a U2 album that they just decided wasn't good enough for the name but Bono and Edge have both said in several cases that the whole idea of the project was for them to be Eno's band for that project and that they did it because they weren't ready to work on a U2 album yet. But people tend to make assumptions very easily and especially after many years of working together they may have gotten lax about negotiating details. Given U2's track record of appreciation and recognition of those who work with them I would give them the benefit of the doubt here and believe that they did not deliberately snub Eno but rather simply didn't realize that he wanted credit. After all, Eno doesn't say that he asked for credit and was denied but simply that when the record came out he wasn't credited. That also adds weight to the idea that he made an assumption.

Dana

 

[ozeeko]

I always thought Eno was like a 5th member of the group. And I've always assumed that a lot of their greatest shit sprung from his ideas and suggestions. I don't think he should be given songwriting credits unless he is actually responsible for writing the bulk of a song. Even if he did come up with a synth sound or riff that fueled the band's creativity, they are still the ones making hooks, melodies and words out of these ideas. If Eno came in to the studio with a concrete song foundation, be it verses and choruses and maybe lyrical ideas, then sure he is entitled to a little more credit. When Steve Lillywhite told Bono and Edge that they needed a chorus to Sometimes, it definitely changed a lot in the song. But still, THEY came up with the hook. They were just taking advice. And you shouldn't get a songwriting cocredit just for advice. Recognition and thank you, maybe.

 

[indra]

I know what you're saying is true, it's just that like I said above, I have mixed feelings about Eno in the first place and I prefer to live in my little fantasy world of u2-does-no-wrong. don't shatter my illusions with your logical arguments, will you?

Gotcha.

I've always tended to like my heros flawed, which sure makes liking them a whole hell of a lot easier when they do something really stupid. At least it's worked for me so far.

 

[U2girl]

Why would BRIAN ENO lie about something like songwriting credits, especially after all this time of working with the band? I don't think there's any reason to believe that he's lying, other than "Bono's the greatest and never lies so Eno must be a moneygrubbing attention-whore."

He's BRIAN ENO. GAH.

It's not uncommon at all for Eno to help compose songs on artists' albums that he's heavily involved in. For example, Talking Heads' Remain in Light. I just don't think there's any reason to believe that he's lying. It's not like he's even making a big deal out of it. He brought it up in an obscure magazine interview some 7 years AFTER the album was released. And he doesn't even mention any desire for money (not like he needs money anyway - once again, he's fucking Brian Eno).

I don't know. But it's confusing since the credits on UF, JT, AB, Zooropa and ATYCLB look pretty much the same: synth credits where he played them, otherwise production/mixing credit. But only one of these albums is an issue. I really don't think the band would have a problem crediting Eno; they did it on Passengers.

I think it is a bit of a deal with him if he talks about it almost 7 years after the album came out. Whether he likes it or not, money is involved in songwriting credits. (that is, if he wants the usual "Music by U2" credit to change into "Music by U2 and Brian Eno" because that means the money will be split in 5 and not 4 parts)

 

[guill]

It is not such a big deal, Miss Sarajevo and Your Blue Room are on the 2nd Best Of, MS is also on the ABOY single and on U2 18 (second disc).
Eno got his money, he can come back.

 

[bgmckinney]

I cleary remember reading somewhere, circa 2001, that Eno played the signature synth progression to "Kite" in the studio one day, and those notes either gave birth to the rest of the song or provided the final piece to tie it all together. I myself have never thought that that synth line, distinctive as it is, is at all an important part of the song as a song; so as far as I'm concerned U2 wrote Kite and Eno nudged them along a bit. I suspect that's the way it usually works. If someone were to take the view that the synth part is an integral part of the song, not merely an ornament, then I suppose they could make a case for Eno getting writing credit. I think that's the heart of the debate.

 

[RademR]

I don't know, I think it's pretty petty for Eno to say some shit like this in a magazine article years later.

But Brian Eno, along with Daniel Lanois, helped shape u2's career. Probably just my opinion, but U2 would not have much of the success they have today if not for that man.

I heard the record he contributed the most to was Achtung Baby, so i gotta love the guy....and no, passengers is not a u2 record.

 

[Headache in a Suitcase]

CNN People You Should Know: Producer Rick Rubin's Sound of Magic

WEST HOLLYWOOD, California (AP) -- Rick Rubin is a healthy reminder of the danger in relying on superficial impressions.

He's a bearish man with long, flowing hair, a bushy beard and ever-present dark sunglasses. See him at a club and you might be tempted to slip out, taking care not to tip over any motorcycles on the way.

Then you would have lost the chance to meet one of the top producers in the music business, who is up for a Grammy award next week in that category. He produced two of the five discs nominated for album of the year and contributed to another, each in completely different styles. He captured the country-pop of the Dixie Chicks and funky rock of the Red Hot Chili Peppers, and produced one track of Justin Timberlake's state-of-the-art dance-pop.

Each of those discs landed in the top 10 of the Rolling Stone magazine reader's poll of favorites from 2006, along with Rubin's fifth album with Johnny Cash, whose late-career resurgence will likely be remembered as one of the producer's most important achievements.

Oh, and that tough guy look? The gentle, soft-spoken Rubin wouldn't let a stranger leave one of his three Los Angeles-area homes recently without wrapping him in a warm hug.

"He's the exact opposite of what you would think he would be," said Emily Robison of the Dixie Chicks. "With the hard rock and rap background, this guy with the long hair and big beard, everyone was a little intimidated by him at first. But when you realize what he's like, he's just a big teddy bear."

If that weren't enough influence, Rubin has been offered a job as co-chairman of Columbia Records and is in talks with executives there, according to a report in the New York Times and confirmed by a close associate of Rubin's who requested anonymity.

Rubin made his name -- and fortune -- at the intersection of rock and rap in the 1980s. He founded the Def Jam label with partner Russell Simmons while a student at New York University, and helped make music by Public Enemy, the Beastie Boys and LL Cool J. He loves the aggressiveness of metal and rap, and was behind Run-DMC's influential cover of Aerosmith's "Walk This Way."

Simmons moved on and Rubin headed West, where his production credits continued to diversify. Slayer, Mick Jagger, AC/DC, Tom Petty, Neil Diamond, Jay-Z and U2 are on the lengthening list of clients.

Unlike Timbaland's jittery beats and synthesizers, Pharrell's spacy soundscapes or Phil Spector's famed "wall of sound," Rubin has no sonic signature.

"I love music and I love bands and my goal, always, working with them is to help them be their best, whatever that is," Rubin said.

The Dixie Chicks were intrigued by Rubin because they noticed his name on a lot of the albums they were listening to. They were sold on him because he didn't come into their first meeting with an agenda, saying how he would make them sound, Robison said.

Most music producers are technical masters, able to manipulate sounds with the twist of a knob, and obsessed about doing so. Rubin freely admits to having little such expertise. He's a fan.

When musicians express an interest in working with him, Rubin's first step is usually to invite them to one of his homes. His place tucked in the West Hollywood hills has intricately-restored woodwork, a statue of Buddha, art from the "Help!"-era Beatles and a kickin' sound system.

They'll talk music. He probes into their history, what made them become artists in the first place, and whether he feels a personal connection.

That's the level on which he bonded with Cash, despite the appearance -- to outside eyes -- that they'd be the least likely of collaborators. Cash was easy to talk to, Rubin recalled, and "had a million songs at his fingertips." They became very close friends.

Rubin had sought out Cash because he was interested in working with an established artist creatively adrift and neglected by the industry. Cash by the early 1990s had nearly given up recording. The deceptively simple approach they set upon of having Cash sing a wide swath of songs to sparse accompaniment yielded five albums (with a sixth posthumously to come) that energized his career.

Cash sang songs he remembered from growing up and unlikely ones fed by Rubin, most memorably Nine Inch Nails' "Hurt."

Neil Diamond: 'He was right'
He's not a producer who spends much time creating in the studio. Rubin has his artists rehearse and experiment extensively ahead of time, so when they enter the studio they know the songs well.

"There's a humanity to a great performance," he said. "It's more like jazz. It could be a pop song or a rock song or a country song, but we approach it more from the standpoint of jazz, and try to get this special interactive moment. We know the tunes, we know the songs, now we're trying to get that special magic moment."

He may be an affable man, but he isn't afraid to tell artists what he thinks. One major star looked at Rubin, mouth agape, when told his songs weren't good enough. Nobody had ever told him that before.

Rubin pushed another artist, Diamond, particularly hard. He made Diamond sing with his acoustic guitar, something he hadn't done since the 1960s. Diamond told The Associated Press upon release of his 2005 disc "12 Songs" that Rubin made him realize that throughout his career the recordings had become more important than the songs, and that was a backwards way of looking at things.

He was grateful when it was done. But he fought every day while working with Rubin.

"Guess what?" Diamond said. "He was right."

Rubin said he believes the artists know that everything he does is to try to make the best music possible.

"A lot of artists really like having someone to bounce things off of, because it's hard to know," he said. "Most of them, especially the ones that are established and have had success, tend to be in a little bit of a vacuum, because most people tell them what they do is great. But there's a lack of reality in that world and it's not beneficial to the artist to be in that world."

He had seen the Dixie Chicks before they became famous and was impressed. Working with them on the "Taking the Long Way" disc interested him because here was a sassy, country-crossover act forced to become serious in the aftermath of the political storm created when singer Natalie Maines criticized President Bush. He was curious how they'd react.

The Dixie Chicks had plenty of ideas but lacked a sense of direction, Robison said. They were also somewhat sensitive to being dictated to, given the experience they'd just been through.

"I think he knows when it's right and he's very decisive, which is refreshing," she said. "But he's also a very good listener. You just respect his ears and his taste so much. That's an earned trust. We knew the legend but we didn't know the actual reason ... We came to learn that it's just that he has great ears."

Rubin just finished a new disc with Linkin Park, and he's working now with Metallica. His dream job is to make a full album with U2; he produced two new songs for their greatest hits disc.

Working so much has its drawbacks, as Rubin learned recently when a friend came over with a mixtape and they listened to the music together. That's kind of cool, Rubin said about one song. Who's singing that?

His friend looked at him incredulously. "You produced it!" he replied.

"I literally had no recollection of it at all," Rubin said, "and I'm a sober person."

Copyright 2007 The Associated Press. All rights reserved.This material may not be published, broadcast, rewritten, or redistributed.



http://www.cnn.com/2007/SHOWBIZ/Music/02/06/grammywatch.rickrubin.ap/index.html

 

[U2girl]

"His dream job is to make a full album with U2; he produced two new songs for their greatest hits disc."

Isn't he producing U2 right now?

 

[Headache in a Suitcase]

i do not believe recording sessions for the new album have officialy begun, and it is in the preliminary stages.

 

[phanan]

In the article, it states that Rubin is encouraging U2 to have the songs written before entering the studio, rather than jamming them out. So U2 are probably in that phase right now while Rubin works with Metallica.

 

[LMP]

In the article, it states that Rubin is encouraging U2 to have the songs written before entering the studio, rather than jamming them out. So U2 are probably in that phase right now while Rubin works with Metallica.

I think so too.

So when Metallica is finished with everything, Rubin will go straight to U2 you think?