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Old 02-19-2008, 06:59 PM   #121
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But I do have to say that all the Eno/Lanois albums have a very "tinny", MIDI-like sound...Beautiful Day should sound like this huge anthem, and it bleats like a sheep. Always frustrates me when I listen to it. I have no idea what Lanois mentioned about wanting to hear Larry on the record...for most part, I feel the drumming sounds castrated.

But I do like the nice meshing of sound you have on ATYCLB of different instruments (electric and acoustic guitars, piano, synths, bass)...I feel that what E/L are good at is blending the instruments, yet maintaining their individuality. I think it has to do with Eno almost always wanting to operate off of a synth "bed". And I think HTDAAB would have been a far better album for it...that, and non rank-amateur quality mixing/compression.
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Old 02-19-2008, 07:12 PM   #122
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Achtung Baby was arguably Edge's best guitar album, and yet you can't hear his guitar parts half the time. That's what pisses me off the most, though there's plenty of pissed off to go around.

I can make a list, in fact:
Zoo Station Chorus
Even Better Than the Real Thing Riff
Until the End of the World Outro
The Fly: Second Half of the Solo/Chorus, Last Verse, Outro
TTTYAATW: All Guitar
Love Is Blindness Solo (Bono Drowns it Out)
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Old 02-19-2008, 08:57 PM   #123
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Quote:
Originally posted by tomtom
for most part, I feel the drumming sounds castrated.
I agree on this. Does anyone remember the early live (or "live") performances of Beautiful Day when Larry couldn't decide whether to play his main part or the electronic beats that cling to the two and four? They eventually settled on him playing along with the loop, but he definitely felt reigned in.
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Old 02-19-2008, 11:26 PM   #124
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Originally posted by ahittle


I agree on this. Does anyone remember the early live (or "live") performances of Beautiful Day when Larry couldn't decide whether to play his main part or the electronic beats that cling to the two and four? They eventually settled on him playing along with the loop, but he definitely felt reigned in.
wait what? can you explain this please? what do you mean two and four? you mean like the beats that fall on 2 and 4 when you count it?
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Old 02-20-2008, 02:14 AM   #125
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Their parts are the half that's being replaced by "electro."


Nice one!

Quote:
Originally posted by Reggie Thee Dog
...I'm uncomfortable with Lanois' 'masterpiece' talk...
You're not alone, Reggie!
I feel the same way.
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Old 02-20-2008, 02:59 AM   #126
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Quote:
Originally posted by phillyfan26
Achtung Baby was arguably Edge's best guitar album, and yet you can't hear his guitar parts half the time. That's what pisses me off the most, though there's plenty of pissed off to go around.

I can make a list, in fact:
Zoo Station Chorus
Even Better Than the Real Thing Riff
Until the End of the World Outro
The Fly: Second Half of the Solo/Chorus, Last Verse, Outro
TTTYAATW: All Guitar
Love Is Blindness Solo (Bono Drowns it Out)
Zoo Station chorus guitar sounds panned right to mid, not really all that more buried than anything else. This is analog recording and it's U2 at their most indirect attempt to sound direct. The overdubbed harmony is louder because it's more important. I don't disagree with this mix.

Even Better....two different verse guitars going. One in the right channel is playing the "riff" and you are right it is quiet, too quiet.
My guess=they had to accomodate the two vocal dubs, not disturb the bass and drums without making it sound jarbled. Is that a word? Maybe it should be louder, I think they made a concentrated decision to get that vocal harmony right. Score.

Until the End of the World, I don't even have to bring up the song to listen to it. I agree but I'd also refer to down below #3.

On the album the Fly solo and outro is fine, of course I heard it in 1991 before 1,000 live versions that followed it. The live versions beat the entire hell out of the studio version, so it seems that the listener has been cheated here. Hard to make an argument against the Fly in 1991, now it's easy. That was a mindfuck single.

Again, Love is Blindness, before the live versions THAT was the song. Afterwards, yeah you can see where the solo is diminshed. The aim of that song on the album is to be haunting. Success. It's not supposed to be a guitar solo wank.

I don't totally disagree overall, I think there are a few factors at play.

1. You younger folk are, no mattter how much you object, generally oblivious to the sound quality of every album before Pop. Louder does not equal better. Muddier doesn't mean lack of quality of mixing or mastering, it means technology was inferior.
It's hard to prove the point unless you are a young audiophile.

2. Accepting that even some of the younger folk get that much, on Acthung there were (thank God) 6, 7 tracks going on at the same time, diverse ideas, someting going on besides the melody brow beat. In that mix, it diminshes everything else. Take the example that a ....say, 4 track mix is X, every track you add diminishes the sound quality of X.

3. After years of hearing improved live versions, if you hear the Sydney version of Love is Blindness first, or at the same time or even listen to it at the most, it gives your ear a natural bias.

When Achtung Baby came out in late 1991, you wouldn't find many people griping about the sound, in fact the only gripes were that u2 were a studio band and Eno and Lanois crafted this album around their marginal talents.

It's a worse mix but it's relative. Also, there are things that can't be apologized for, like the end of Until the End of the World.
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Old 02-20-2008, 03:13 AM   #127
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Muddy. Reverb-heavy. Murky.
That was the point - they wanted that kind of production. They needed that sound.

Eno and Lanois always get the sound the band wants: from the landscapes of UF, to the warm/big space sound of JT, to the murky sound of AB, and the slick, polished up sound of ATYCLB. Of course it's another thing to compare studio and live versions of songs.

Reggie: If they feel they have another masterpiece in them, why not say so ? At least if they fail, they will fail big, too !
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Old 02-20-2008, 03:35 AM   #128
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Originally posted by tomtom
for most part, I feel the drumming sounds castrated.

That's our Larry for you!
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Old 02-20-2008, 04:00 AM   #129
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Originally posted by phillyfan26

Love Is Blindness Solo (Bono Drowns it Out)
Agree with that for sure. Whenever I feel like listening to that I always go for one of the ZooTV performences - usually the b-side to the Stay single.
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Old 02-20-2008, 10:35 AM   #130
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And Adam and Larry?
u2valencia, some pics - including Adam

http://picasaweb.google.es/u2valenci...uayJoseStation
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Old 02-26-2008, 08:16 AM   #131
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Originally posted by tomtom
But I do have to say that all the Eno/Lanois albums have a very "tinny", MIDI-like sound...Beautiful Day should sound like this huge anthem, and it bleats like a sheep. Always frustrates me when I listen to it. I have no idea what Lanois mentioned about wanting to hear Larry on the record...for most part, I feel the drumming sounds castrated.
I couldn't agree more. I don't like the song on ATCYLB (and HTDAAB). It's seems to be produced and mixed using MIDI program
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Old 02-26-2008, 08:34 AM   #132
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Originally posted by Inner El Guapo


Zoo Station chorus guitar sounds panned right to mid, not really all that more buried than anything else. This is analog recording and it's U2 at their most indirect attempt to sound direct. The overdubbed harmony is louder because it's more important. I don't disagree with this mix.

Even Better....two different verse guitars going. One in the right channel is playing the "riff" and you are right it is quiet, too quiet.
My guess=they had to accomodate the two vocal dubs, not disturb the bass and drums without making it sound jarbled. Is that a word? Maybe it should be louder, I think they made a concentrated decision to get that vocal harmony right. Score.

Until the End of the World, I don't even have to bring up the song to listen to it. I agree but I'd also refer to down below #3.

On the album the Fly solo and outro is fine, of course I heard it in 1991 before 1,000 live versions that followed it. The live versions beat the entire hell out of the studio version, so it seems that the listener has been cheated here. Hard to make an argument against the Fly in 1991, now it's easy. That was a mindfuck single.

Again, Love is Blindness, before the live versions THAT was the song. Afterwards, yeah you can see where the solo is diminshed. The aim of that song on the album is to be haunting. Success. It's not supposed to be a guitar solo wank.

I don't totally disagree overall, I think there are a few factors at play.

1. You younger folk are, no mattter how much you object, generally oblivious to the sound quality of every album before Pop. Louder does not equal better. Muddier doesn't mean lack of quality of mixing or mastering, it means technology was inferior.
It's hard to prove the point unless you are a young audiophile.

2. Accepting that even some of the younger folk get that much, on Acthung there were (thank God) 6, 7 tracks going on at the same time, diverse ideas, someting going on besides the melody brow beat. In that mix, it diminshes everything else. Take the example that a ....say, 4 track mix is X, every track you add diminishes the sound quality of X.

3. After years of hearing improved live versions, if you hear the Sydney version of Love is Blindness first, or at the same time or even listen to it at the most, it gives your ear a natural bias.

When Achtung Baby came out in late 1991, you wouldn't find many people griping about the sound, in fact the only gripes were that u2 were a studio band and Eno and Lanois crafted this album around their marginal talents.

It's a worse mix but it's relative. Also, there are things that can't be apologized for, like the end of Until the End of the World.
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Old 02-26-2008, 09:52 AM   #133
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Quote:
Originally posted by Inner El Guapo


Zoo Station chorus guitar sounds panned right to mid, not really all that more buried than anything else. This is analog recording and it's U2 at their most indirect attempt to sound direct. The overdubbed harmony is louder because it's more important. I don't disagree with this mix.

Even Better....two different verse guitars going. One in the right channel is playing the "riff" and you are right it is quiet, too quiet.
My guess=they had to accomodate the two vocal dubs, not disturb the bass and drums without making it sound jarbled. Is that a word? Maybe it should be louder, I think they made a concentrated decision to get that vocal harmony right. Score.

Until the End of the World, I don't even have to bring up the song to listen to it. I agree but I'd also refer to down below #3.

On the album the Fly solo and outro is fine, of course I heard it in 1991 before 1,000 live versions that followed it. The live versions beat the entire hell out of the studio version, so it seems that the listener has been cheated here. Hard to make an argument against the Fly in 1991, now it's easy. That was a mindfuck single.

Again, Love is Blindness, before the live versions THAT was the song. Afterwards, yeah you can see where the solo is diminshed. The aim of that song on the album is to be haunting. Success. It's not supposed to be a guitar solo wank.

I don't totally disagree overall, I think there are a few factors at play.

1. You younger folk are, no mattter how much you object, generally oblivious to the sound quality of every album before Pop. Louder does not equal better. Muddier doesn't mean lack of quality of mixing or mastering, it means technology was inferior.
It's hard to prove the point unless you are a young audiophile.

2. Accepting that even some of the younger folk get that much, on Acthung there were (thank God) 6, 7 tracks going on at the same time, diverse ideas, someting going on besides the melody brow beat. In that mix, it diminshes everything else. Take the example that a ....say, 4 track mix is X, every track you add diminishes the sound quality of X.

3. After years of hearing improved live versions, if you hear the Sydney version of Love is Blindness first, or at the same time or even listen to it at the most, it gives your ear a natural bias.

When Achtung Baby came out in late 1991, you wouldn't find many people griping about the sound, in fact the only gripes were that u2 were a studio band and Eno and Lanois crafted this album around their marginal talents.

It's a worse mix but it's relative. Also, there are things that can't be apologized for, like the end of Until the End of the World.


Though I still think the studio version of The Fly is the best.
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Old 02-27-2008, 02:20 AM   #134
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Quote:
Originally posted by Axver
...since everything I know is wrong.
Finally! You finally admit it. Whew... and I was getting worried.

As for the topic... eh. I've heard so many statements over the years about U2's next work - both from U2 and others - that it means nothing to me. I will wait until I hear the actual music first.
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Old 02-27-2008, 03:19 AM   #135
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Originally posted by An Cat Gav




Though I still think the studio version of The Fly is the best.
well, one thing that bugs me about the Fly on the album is the solo doesn't have the same feel, it's just not as powerful as it is live....that's just how I hear it

while we're on the subject....if you listen to 1992 Washington D.C.

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