The Evolution of U2's Creative Process

[kiwilad]

I'm trying to figure out what the point is.that U2 have always relied heavily on their producers? That Henry Rollins had a point? What are you trying to prove?

Ah man. Let me break into nice wee bits for you.
Someone starts an interesting, speculative thread.
Interference regular attacks thread and original poster.
I defend point of thread.
Another Interference regular attacks me.

Nice work.

 

[BVS]

Have we become so over sensitive that turning someone’s own question on them is considered an attack?

And then participating in said thread is an attack?

Are we going to have to create safe spaces where no matter what you say everyone has to agree?

Is it an interesting topic? Yes
Was it laced with trolly speculation? Yes

It can be both.

 

[Headache in a Suitcase]

Ah man. Let me break into nice wee bits for you.
Someone starts an interesting, speculative thread.
Interference regular attacks thread and original poster.
I defend point of thread.
Another Interference regular attacks me.

Nice work.

I'm sorry, what exactly was the attack in my post? Could you point it out for me?

Nobody attacked you. I'm genuinely interested in what the point is. Would knowing that U2 have historically relied more heavily on producers than many other acts take something away from your enjoyment of them?

 

[Gzusfrk]

I guess what I was trying to engage others in discussing waa the "evolution" of that process. Headache, maybe you feel that it has not really changed over the years, but I disagree. Or maybe the songwriting piece which first became a topic with ATYCLB is more out in the open now because of the internet? Who knows?

I guess the gestation of Summer of Love really has me intrigued.

 

[Montrose]

So with SOE now released, we have been getting bits of info on "how" this album was made.



The first "aha" moment for me was Eno getting co-writing credit on Luminous Times, but again, I don't know how involved Brian and Danny were in the actual creation of the songs on the album.




Again, in my opinion, the 90's were U2's creative peak, AB through Pop, but then the creative process seems to get cloudy. Eno upset about songwriting credits on ATYCLB, the "collaboration" on NLOTH, then we come to the current period.



I admit, as much as I love Summer of Love, it's nagging me a bit that Ryan Tedder/One Republic MAY have written huge portions of the song, but without songwriting credit. It nagged me a little that he wrote the chorus melody of EBW, not because of the quality, I love it, but no songwriting credit.



I know lines are blurred often with producers/writers/co-creators etc, but to ME, this may be a transparency issue for U2. Are they seeking relevance and the "fountain of youth" so badly that they will pay other songwriters to NOT get a co-writing credit, and pretend it's their own work??



. It won't stop me from enjoying SOE, but it may help us understand where the band is REALLY at creatively after 40 years.



Thoughts??

Maybe if your thread was titled "Do U2 write all their own material?" Or something to that effect, you'd get a little more direct discussion about what you're really aiming at.

You're not interested in their creative process - you want to know how much their producers wrote for them. You mention an 'aha' moment where it's like you discovered some dark secret, then go about selecting a very small number of tracks where some added contributions to a song have or may have come in.

You can also talk about Edge doing the happy dance when he, alone in his house, figured out the Streets riff. Or in that recent radio interview, how Adam said Edge came up with a bassline, but Adam 'inhabited' it. Or how Larry was stoked about how his bassline made the cut for a zoo-era song ?

I know how you feel - there's a credit somewhere in ATYCLB about a guitar bit played by someone else. It might have been Wild Honey or In a Little While, and I was a bit 'hmm, they really meant it when they said they'd take any good idea that came up". Then I got over it, and realized that if this band was looking for a sound, a piece to fill a spot, a new twist on a melody or chord progression , and we're jamming with the producers or session musicians or whomever - if they heard something they knew worked, they'd use it.

That's what's part of the creative process. The band knows , or at least has a sense, on where they want the song to go, what it needs to become. It's their job to use their tools - their own playing and songwriting, and the input from their production team - to shepherd it there.

 

[Headache in a Suitcase]

I guess what I was trying to engage others in discussing waa the "evolution" of that process. Headache, maybe you feel that it has not really changed over the years, but I disagree. Or maybe the songwriting piece which first became a topic with ATYCLB is more out in the open now because of the internet? Who knows?

I guess the gestation of Summer of Love really has me intrigued.

The recently reposted thread in the new album section speaks of Eno and Lanois and their long history of debates with U2 over writing credits. It's worth a read.

The band has operated this way since as far back as Unforgettable Fire. It's becoming more a subject now with this video (which still doesn't confirm one way or the other who actually wrote the song, btw). Eno and Lanois were paid a percentage rather than a flat fee specifically in place of song writing credit, but eventually that became an issue, apparently around Bomb when Eno felt lots of his work from All That You Can't Leave Behind was used and not credited properly, as he wasn't a main producer on that album.

 

[Gzusfrk]

Ok, as for some reason, some are really personally offended by this conversation and feel the strange need to "defend U2's honor" this is the last thing I'll say about this.

Again, referencing Summer of Love, yes we don't know the whole story yet, but let me just ask...

Why would Ryan Tedder make a video clip talking about new music they were working on, obviously pumped about it, if it was a U2 idea? He doesn't need U2. He's so prolific right now, he writes hits for other people with some to spare for his own band!

IMHO, he wouldn't make a video all excited about playing a U2 idea. I know BVS, and Montrose may get upset by my opinion, but it's just an opinion.

 

[Headache in a Suitcase]

Ok, as for some reason, some are really personally offended by this conversation and feel the strange need to "defend U2's honor" this is the last thing I'll say about this.

Again, referencing Summer of Love, yes we don't know the whole story yet, but let me just ask...

Why would Ryan Tedder make a video clip talking about new music they were working on, obviously pumped about it, if it was a U2 idea? He doesn't need U2. He's so prolific right now, he writes hits for other people with some to spare for his own band!

IMHO, he wouldn't make a video all excited about playing a U2 idea. I know BVS, and Montrose may get upset by my opinion, but it's just an opinion.

So the video in question is fan made, where he spliced together various videos that Tedder released via Snapchat.

The kids, it seems, post lots of things on the Snapchat.

It's selectively edited, and there's no way of knowing for sure whether or not anything was said before or after that would change the story.

That being said, U2 have a long, multi decade history of giving producers percentages on their deals so that they don't have to give them a writing credit. So it's entirely possible that the ideas for Summer of Love came from Tedder and he gave them with U2, and doesn't get a writing credit because of his particular deal. It just seems unlikely due to the sheer number of credits handed out on this album (and because they gave writing credits to Danger Mouse).

I think the issues if whether this is normal practice of U2 (it is) and wether or not this video confirms anything (it doesn't) are two separate, yet related, discussions melded into one.

 

[Montrose]

Ok, as for some reason, some are really personally offended by this conversation and feel the strange need to "defend U2's honor" this is the last thing I'll say about this.

Again, referencing Summer of Love, yes we don't know the whole story yet, but let me just ask...

Why would Ryan Tedder make a video clip talking about new music they were working on, obviously pumped about it, if it was a U2 idea? He doesn't need U2. He's so prolific right now, he writes hits for other people with some to spare for his own band!

IMHO, he wouldn't make a video all excited about playing a U2 idea. I know BVS, and Montrose may get upset by my opinion, but it's just an opinion.

I'm not upset about your opinion, I just generally don't like when someone tries to disguise their motivations. U2's creative process and its evolution is a topic that can go well beyond just picking out the points where they absorb some outside influences into their music.

That said, there's this:

https://twitter.com/1Rdaily/status/936676186431860739

 

[Montrose]

Here's the gathering of the different bits:
https://twitter.com/1rdaily/status/709654384523796480

Who knows - could have been a bit that came from the SOI sessions then went back to OR, then back to U2, or could have been something Tedder played for U2, and Bono had a take on the 'West Coast' lyrics, and they said, "Hey, why don't you take it". Thing is, we don't know.

 

[BVS]

Ok, as for some reason, some are really personally offended by this conversation and feel the strange need to "defend U2's honor" this is the last thing I'll say about this.

Again, referencing Summer of Love, yes we don't know the whole story yet, but let me just ask...

Why would Ryan Tedder make a video clip talking about new music they were working on, obviously pumped about it, if it was a U2 idea? He doesn't need U2. He's so prolific right now, he writes hits for other people with some to spare for his own band!

IMHO, he wouldn't make a video all excited about playing a U2 idea. I know BVS, and Montrose may get upset by my opinion, but it's just an opinion.

No one’s upset over your opinion, I’m stating my opinion and interpretation of the facts presented just like you. Stop trying so hard.

In case you can’t tell the video is spliced together. He could have easily said, this is a track I’m producing for U2 it’s going to be killer.

Yeah, if you’re producing one of your inspirations, you’d probably be pretty fucking excited. I do think he talks about that track much differently than he speaks of his own.

 

[Gzusfrk]

I'm not upset about your opinion, I just generally don't like when someone tries to disguise their motivations. U2's creative process and its evolution is a topic that can go well beyond just picking out the points where they absorb some outside influences into their music.

That said, there's this:

https://twitter.com/1Rdaily/status/936676186431860739

Montrose, hey I know I’m new here, but one thing I will never do is disguise my motivations. I have loved and grown up with U2 since 84, and I still love them. I find the creative process fascinating, and admit to being a nerd about every ounce of info about my favorite artists and how they create.

I love Brian Wilson and The Beach Boys, and remember agonizing over the release of Smile in 2004, wondering how much were Brian’s ideas and those of his many talented collaborators!

 

[Montrose]

Montrose, hey I know I’m new here, but one thing I will never do is disguise my motivations. I have loved and grown up with U2 since 84, and I still love them. I find the creative process fascinating, and admit to being a nerd about every ounce of info about my favorite artists and how they create.

I love Brian Wilson and The Beach Boys, and remember agonizing over the release of Smile in 2004, wondering how much were Brian’s ideas and those of his many talented collaborators!

And I appreciate fandom! Like I said, and won't beat a dead horse, but: there's a difference in talking about their creative evolution, and basically only wanting to talk about tracks where someone else may have written something.

It's like going in for your annual review at your job, and the manager saying, "Ok, let's see how you evolved over this year", and then proceeding to only talk about on which projects you may have not given sufficient credit to another co-worker.

But maybe that was just an unfortunate choice in thread title, and we'll never actually get to that discussion, but just in case..

Where do you think all the other tracks on SOE stand in their creative evolution?

What's your take on the HAIM riff and involvement on LOH?

 

[kiwilad]

I'm trying to figure out what the point is.that U2 have always relied heavily on their producers? That Henry Rollins had a point? What are you trying to prove?

I guess what it turns out I'm proving is that I didn't know as much about this stuff as you and others!!
I didn't follow the Eno fallout at the time, and didn't understand how involved producers were until very recently. I kinda thought they just offered encouragement and twiddled knobs.
Has it really always been this way since 84? I know Lanois played instruments and Eno played some keys and samples etc. Didn't actually realise they were also writing riffs and meoldies... My naivity on display it seems.

The point though, of the post you responded to, was that this is an interesting discussion and doesn't deserve being shut down by the louder voices who already know all the answers. You might know all this. I don't.
And perhaps you could bear in mind tjat while you're clearly not intimidated by the idea of posting here, or starting a thread, or laying down an opinion and defending it, others are (I'm not speaking for the original poster here).
But I'm loving the new voices on this site and don't want them to all give up and go off to the new U2 forum currently trying to recruit members.
Perhaps newer posters could be treated with a little more friendliness than the beginning of this thread had?

 

[kiwilad]

I'm sorry, what exactly was the attack in my post? Could you point it out for me?

Nobody attacked you. I'm genuinely interested in what the point is. Would knowing that U2 have historically relied more heavily on producers than many other acts take something away from your enjoyment of them?

And... I quoted the wrong quote. Legend.
Apologies for overeacting dude.

 

[Gzusfrk]

Well, the Haim thing was curious to me, but at least they gave them a songwriting credit. Funny thing is, I prefer the string version, where the Haim riff is less pronounced, maybe not even needed.

Again, in my original post I was hoping for more of a discussion on the evolution of U2’s creative process! Again, I asked for others to offer their knowledge because I only know what I know, and am sure others know more!

And with Luminous Times, the “aha” moment was a surprise because I think that was the first song that wasn’t the iconic “Words by Bono, Music by U2”.

As far as the rest of SOE, I like it all, a bit shocked at nine producers, but again I think it’s fair to discuss how it was made. Earlier in the conversation EBW was the focus, just an open dialogue was what I was hoping for

 

[nathan1977]

HTDAAB was the first time where I remember being struck by the number of producers on the album (Lillywhite, Jacknife Lee, Flood, Eno/Lanois, Chris Thomas), and feeling dissatisfied with the result. It was an album that was less than the sum of its parts -- at parts punk rock, at others adult contemporary, still others fussy and overarranged. That being said, SOE has more producers, but to me feels much more cohesive -- which makes me think that it's less about the number of cooks in the kitchen and more about the focus of the band. This album's creative focus -- life, mortality, etc -- comes from Bono, and I think has helped the album feel like one thing. I'm less of a fan of the pop singles (they're fine, but for me they're the weakest part of the album), but that middle trilogy of Red Flag/Summer of Love/American Love is great, and Love Is Bigger and Landlady are, for me, emotional monsters.

 

[corianderstem]

Agreed re SOE being more cohesive, despite so many producers. I remember being shocked recently when I was reminded of how many producers worked on this album.

 

[Montrose]

Well, the Haim thing was curious to me, but at least they gave them a songwriting credit. Funny thing is, I prefer the string version, where the Haim riff is less pronounced, maybe not even needed.

Again, in my original post I was hoping for more of a discussion on the evolution of U2’s creative process! Again, I asked for others to offer their knowledge because I only know what I know, and am sure others know more!

And with Luminous Times, the “aha” moment was a surprise because I think that was the first song that wasn’t the iconic “Words by Bono, Music by U2”.

As far as the rest of SOE, I like it all, a bit shocked at nine producers, but again I think it’s fair to discuss how it was made. Earlier in the conversation EBW was the focus, just an open dialogue was what I was hoping for

Sure.

My take is that I try to remember U2 was a band that started out from scratch - they were still learning to play their instruments at the time they formed a band, and they kept pushing to grow, to be discovered, to make great music and break out into the world while still figuring out how to write songs and play them. They learned from other bands, from the music they listened to, and from the producers who came in to help them beat their songs into shape. The creativity, to me, was mainly U2, but their methods to turning that creativity into 'product' were always a tad nontraditional.

Their songwriting has always been multi-directional. Even hearing them talk about SOE and how the producers say they approach music in a very different way, about how no song or idea is sacred until the last minute, where things can change up until the record is pressed - reminds me of the same old U2.

I always thought of U2 as a band that had very good ideas and very, very good ears for songs and sounds. They'd come up with little nuggets and then try to jam around it and listen for songs to emerge. Producers would suggest, direct, try to include a inspiration here and there. Eno always talked about how he'd have a little loop going to provide a platform to start with. I think U2's not hesitant about taking those inputs and keeping them if they fit the song. And that's the thing - for a band that sound so much like itself, they're pretty self-less about including any component that fits, if it fits. It's about the song.

U2 has their working arrangement set in stone: U2's 4 members get equal credit for everything. Anyone who works with them needs to accept that going in. Whether a producer gets a flat fee, or a percentage, or whatever, can vary depending on their involvement and the initial arrangement. And if, say, Tedder did come up with the guitar part and the 'Thinking 'bout the West Coast' portion of the song, and has no problem with U2 taking it and helping flesh it out into a new, U2 song then that's how the creative process went with *that* song. Same thing with the sample with Do You Feel Loved - they took it, Edge played it his way, and it became part of a larger U2 song. Other tunes may have a simpler, more straight-forward genesis with U2 doing most of the musical work, and a producer just tweaking, adding some bells and whistles and whatnot.

To be a fly on the wall in those sessions, right?

 

[BVS]

The band couldn’t afford to rent studio space improvise, write, and record in the studio like they do now. They came in with demos or ideas and recorded in the more traditional manner. But even then songs would take on new shapes and directions due to a producer’s suggestions.

Then with UF they started improving, writing, and recording in a studio with producers. Those producers would sometimes play along, make suggestions, or create starting points.

During that improv they might like the keyboard riff that’s a reaction to their playing and Bono might decide to sing the vocal melody instead of the guitar riff. The producer may say, try walking it up to that note and see how it sounds, or try singing the second line like this.

A lot this can be considered writing the melody, right? But this is how studio bands like U2 work.

I think as of late u2 has become a combo; of coming in with more demos and improv in studio.

If we see another album from U2 I would like to see a half and half, one side focused on craft, and the other half just creating those soundscapes.

 

[Montrose]

The band couldn’t afford to rent studio space improvise, write, and record in the studio like they do now. They came in with demos or ideas and recorded in the more traditional manner. But even then songs would take on new shapes and directions due to a producer’s suggestions.

Then with UF they started improving, writing, and recording in a studio with producers. Those producers would sometimes play along, make suggestions, or create starting points.

During that improv they might like the keyboard riff that’s a reaction to their playing and Bono might decide to sing the vocal melody instead of the guitar riff. The producer may say, try walking it up to that note and see how it sounds, or try singing the second line like this.

A lot this can be considered writing the melody, right? But this is how studio bands like U2 work.

I think as of late u2 has become a combo; of coming in with more demos and improv in studio.

If we see another album from U2 I would like to see a half and half, one side focused on craft, and the other half just creating those soundscapes.

We always talk about how slow album releases from U2 are now compared to, say, cranking out 5 albums in the 80's. Maybe it was quicker to approach albums like they did in the early days - rough songs, a hammering-out period with Lilywhite, then release. Things only slow down once Eno and Lanois came aboard, so the whole sonic-landscape, collaborative production approach seems to be more intensive. Or maybe U2 hit a point where they ran out of their own rough songs and needed the added inspiration to craft new ones. They've always been great at finding - or creating - motivation to keep going when other bands might have dried up.

But there was also that 2-3 year period before Boy where they apparently built up a 40-song repertoire to bring into the recording of their first album. They were young, just got signed to a label, and realized they were better at making their own tunes than being a cover band. I'm not sure, their lives being what they are, that U2 has the luxury to build up a healthy song repertoire to bring into a studio as much, and I think SOE feels like they, for the first time in a while, had a lot to choose from. That bodes well for having future releases if they want to keep going. Like you said, a combo 'demo' and 'jam' approach. The upside to all those hospital trips might have been a quiet point to gather up new material.

Also, there seems to have been a point - somewhere between TUF and Achtung - where the band's approach shifted from a 4-person jam-session for creating new stuff, to electing Edge as 'musical director' and Bono keeping the helm as the big-idea man.

Somewhere after Achtung, Larry and Adam took music lessons. Later on, after the Rubin sessions, I think Bono took some piano lessons. You can see periods from their history where they either collectively or individually sensed they either hit a wall or were close to hitting one, and took steps to be able to keep moving forward.

In Bono's case, the piano must come in handy now that his accident left him more or less unable to use the guitar to get his ideas out.

It'll be interesting to see, production-wise, where they go next.

 

[Iggy Fizz]

Andy Barlow

https://www.billboard.com/articles/...barlow-interview-u2-producer-songs-experience

I ran across this article thanks to my Google news feed. Interesting insights here.

I will admit that while I really like a lot of SOE, the escalating reliance on producers and others bothers me. Feels like the band are essentially outsourcing most of the creative process and simply showing up to record their bits and sing lyrics they may or may not have written.

Andy's comment about the 'huge family' sounds more like 'huge corporation'.

I've said before that these guys are a very part time band nowadays but it feels like they've taken it to a new level. At what point is this not a U2 album and merely a U2 franchise effort???

Take this quote - wow:

When Bono writes he doesn't write lyrics per se. We call it Bongolese. He'll basically make up words about the view or the cup of coffee he's drinking -- just pure channeling -- and from that we would find what feels good and piece it together. The next day he would listen to the vocal shape that we came up with, write a narrative and, when he was excited by something, take it to The Edge.

Or this one - another wow:

I've got to say, it was quite unnerving. I've never done a multi-producer record before. And for 21 years I've been an artist where you get very attached to ideas and songs are like your children. So when other producers got involved and began chopping up my children, I had to swiftly learn to be less precious about my ideas. The good thing about it is that we were all pitching ideas for the band and from that they could then piece together how the whole arrangement was going to flow.

 

[Headache in a Suitcase]

https://www.billboard.com/articles/...barlow-interview-u2-producer-songs-experience


I've said before that these guys are a very part time band nowadays but it feels like they've taken it to a new level. At what point is this not a U2 album and merely a U2 franchise effort???

Take this quote - wow:

When Bono writes he doesn't write lyrics per se. We call it Bongolese. He'll basically make up words about the view or the cup of coffee he's drinking -- just pure channeling -- and from that we would find what feels good and piece it together. The next day he would listen to the vocal shape that we came up with, write a narrative and, when he was excited by something, take it to The Edge.

.

This is quite literally how Bono has always written.

Lillywhite also has a slightly different perspective on the creative impact of the lost lyrics—and Bono’s songwriting in general—he’s gleaned from working closely with U2 over the years. “For him, the lyric writing and the melody and the sound all came at the same time,” he says. “Even if these poems and these journals had turned into lyrics—even if he hadn’t lost them—whether they would have become the lyrics to the album, I’m not sure. Knowing him at the time, he wasn’t that sort of a writer. Most of the famous people I’ve worked with actually, [especially artists such as] Dave Matthews [and] David Byrne, they write in tongues as they’re singing, and then they evolve the words from that. In fact, Bono even has a word for his not-finished lyrics: a language called Bongolese is what we call it.”

That's Steve Lillywhite talking about working on October.

 

[trevgreg]

Sure.

My take is that I try to remember U2 was a band that started out from scratch - they were still learning to play their instruments at the time they formed a band, and they kept pushing to grow, to be discovered, to make great music and break out into the world while still figuring out how to write songs and play them. They learned from other bands, from the music they listened to, and from the producers who came in to help them beat their songs into shape. The creativity, to me, was mainly U2, but their methods to turning that creativity into 'product' were always a tad nontraditional.

Their songwriting has always been multi-directional. Even hearing them talk about SOE and how the producers say they approach music in a very different way, about how no song or idea is sacred until the last minute, where things can change up until the record is pressed - reminds me of the same old U2.

I always thought of U2 as a band that had very good ideas and very, very good ears for songs and sounds. They'd come up with little nuggets and then try to jam around it and listen for songs to emerge. Producers would suggest, direct, try to include a inspiration here and there. Eno always talked about how he'd have a little loop going to provide a platform to start with. I think U2's not hesitant about taking those inputs and keeping them if they fit the song. And that's the thing - for a band that sound so much like itself, they're pretty self-less about including any component that fits, if it fits. It's about the song.

U2 has their working arrangement set in stone: U2's 4 members get equal credit for everything. Anyone who works with them needs to accept that going in. Whether a producer gets a flat fee, or a percentage, or whatever, can vary depending on their involvement and the initial arrangement. And if, say, Tedder did come up with the guitar part and the 'Thinking 'bout the West Coast' portion of the song, and has no problem with U2 taking it and helping flesh it out into a new, U2 song then that's how the creative process went with *that* song. Same thing with the sample with Do You Feel Loved - they took it, Edge played it his way, and it became part of a larger U2 song. Other tunes may have a simpler, more straight-forward genesis with U2 doing most of the musical work, and a producer just tweaking, adding some bells and whistles and whatnot.

To be a fly on the wall in those sessions, right?

Right on. And truth be told, I'm not even 100% that this approach is unique to just U2. Every producer-artist relationship is unique in its own way, but I wouldn't be surprised if most acts are at a point where they take at least some direction from an engineer or producer on where to take a song or what to add/subtract from it.

That's Steve Lillywhite talking about working on October.

Yep. I think the U2 At the End of the World book also gives a similar approach for how he wrote Stay.

 

[Iggy Fizz]

yes, Bono has always been a stream- of-consciousness type... but the extent to which he relies on others to finish his initial garbles seems to have grown significantly...

 

[BVS]

yes, Bono has always been a stream- of-consciousness type... but the extent to which he relies on others to finish his initial garbles seems to have grown significantly...

Where are you getting that, from that quote? No where in that quote does he say anything about someone else finishing his "garbles".

 

[Iggy Fizz]

Edit to previous post:

yes, Bono has always been a stream- of-consciousness type... but the extent to which he relies on others to help finish his initial garbles seems to have grown significantly...

 

[womanfish]

ok, this whole Summer of Love business is pretty ridiculous to me.

We have to believe that Tedder/One Rep. had a song called West Coast - and then at some point Bono/U2 heard it and they liked it so much that they said, we'd love to use it in some way.

And then Bono and the boys, instead of just using the riff, or some part of the song structure and coming up with new lyrics, said NO, we are too lazy for that and want to just use the song.
So then Bono manufactured a story about looking out on the ocean and thinking about the "other west coast" across the sea that was so different than the one he was standing on - JUST so it could fit into the song title/lyrics/chorus of the One Republic song!?!?! Then regale reporters with his phony story, just to cover up the use of the One Republic song.
And then made sure that Tedder was rewarded handsomely instead of giving any writing credits.

This is what we are to believe, and not that U2 had a riff, or rough cut of a song, gave it to Tedder for a while to work on and come up with some ideas and changes and bring it back and see if the band liked it, and then work on it some more?

Really

 

[BVS]

Edit to previous post:

yes, Bono has always been a stream- of-consciousness type... but the extent to which he relies on others to help finish his initial garbles seems to have grown significantly...

But he doesn't. You're misunderstanding something in that quote.

He records bonogolese, he listens back, he writes lyric, once he has something he likes he runs to Edge.

This is how he has ALWAYS written his melodies and lyrics.

 

[Iggy Fizz]

No misunderstanding, but thanks.