Pop album - what went wrong..?

[Von Schloopen]

This right here is what went wrong with "Pop."

I find it hysterical. Rockist audiences didn't. Singing about "chewing bubblegum" and "lovey dovey stuff" over a dance beats didn't help.

On the plus side, what went right really went right. That record has some gems.

 

[Irvine511]

the presentation of the Pop "big ideas" -- consumerism, mocking U2 as product, soul inside the neon -- wasn't totally thought through either. what were they doing? what was PopMart really about? i suspect they didn't quite know either. and that stands in comparison to Zoo TV, which was incredibly coherent and skillfully mixed the big ideas with stadium rock god-ery and spectacular music. i'd argue their greatest artistic achievement is that tour, and from Bono's onstage personas to the concert narrative, they got everything right. and it made sense -- even if you didn't get it, it worked. read Race of Angels for more on that.

Pop and PopMart, not so much. it was too clever by half, and yet half baked; a deep dive that came up short. and it's too bad, there was a lot going on there.

 

[Von Schloopen]

Well put. Don't think it helped that the early shows didn't rock. If they'd come out guns blazing, blowing people away, it may have helped.

Why cut the bridge out of "I Will Follow"?

 

[Thrillhouse]

the presentation of the Pop "big ideas" -- consumerism, mocking U2 as product, soul inside the neon -- wasn't totally thought through either. what were they doing? what was PopMart really about? i suspect they didn't quite know either. and that stands in comparison to Zoo TV, which was incredibly coherent and skillfully mixed the big ideas with stadium rock god-ery and spectacular music. i'd argue their greatest artistic achievement is that tour, and from Bono's onstage personas to the concert narrative, they got everything right. and it made sense -- even if you didn't get it, it worked. read Race of Angels for more on that.

Pop and PopMart, not so much. it was too clever by half, and yet half baked; a deep dive that came up short. and it's too bad, there was a lot going on there.

can't be argued. it's fact. end of story.

 

[chork]

This right here is what went wrong with "Pop."

Now, I'm sorry, but that right there goddamned worked for me.

 

[jeevey]

I was waiting for you to pop in on that. Never fails.

 

[chork]

Like a fly on honey, baby!

 

[allbecauseofu2]

Album wise it matches up better for me vs ab and zooropa. The tour was a bit one dimensional. But has some great moments for me. But zoo TV was just epic. Right time right place right album. Right songs. Right everything.

 

[Thrillhouse]

Now, I'm sorry, but that right there goddamned worked for me.

yea i liked the video myself. i'm not much for U2's videos but i did enjoy the Disco. video

 

[allbecauseofu2]

zooropa was a commercial failure. yup. In other news , since Santana's supernatural album was by far and away his biggest seller, his entire career is a failure retroactive to 1969. Ya know the career that made him a rock and roll hall of famer and a legend.

 

[U2DMfan]

I don't agree with this at all.

I don't either. Now, I'm not a huge lyrical junkie. I'm a musician, I am moved more by music (emotions, drama, etc.) than lyrics. Music is an auditory medium like film is a visual medium, lyrics can be entirely secondary, but the lyrics on MOFO are good enough. Mofo is U2 at their best. Had they conjured up 7 or 8 more MOFO's, or something close, we'd all be talking about POP like it was a nearly unquestioned masterpiece. And if Gone weren't on the album, I'd consider MOFO the best song on POP by a light year.

Also, I happen to think it's their singular best song (live performances taken fully into consideration) since Zooropa and/or Lemon.

 

[The Panther]

Had they conjured up 7 or 8 more MOFO's, or something close, we'd all be talking about POP like it was a nearly unquestioned masterpiece.

Actually, I doubt we'd be talking at all, since if the album had had 8 'Mofo's' it would most certainly have been the end of U2 as commercial artists, they would have subsequently broken up, and this forum would not now exist.

 

[LemonMelon]

Also, I happen to think it's their singular best song (live performances taken fully into consideration) since Zooropa and/or Lemon.

I can agree with your list. I would probably throw a Passengers track or two in there, and MOS, but yeah.

The two Zooropa songs would probably be or near the top though. I've been listening to Lemon a great deal lately and am utterly astounded by everything that happens in it. The bass line is arguably Adam's best, the vocal is spectacular, Edge's guitar tone...how the fuck did he come up with that? Where did that sense of adventure go after Pop? His guitar has never sounded anywhere near that dreamy or psychedelic since. He colors that track as skillfully as he did so much of TUF. Say what you want about his lack of technical prowess, but that song would be a shell of itself without him. And once you know the story behind the lyrics, they're heartbreaking.

Funny thing is, I probably like the song less than Zooropa and Stay.

This right here is what went wrong with "Pop."

Yup. Classic example of a lead single destroying an album's momentum early. I think the video is hilarious, but fans took half a second to consider the possibility that it was facetious, which most people wouldn't think to consider with U2.

 

[Muldfeld]

I recently started listening to the Pop album again – has some good tunes like Do You Feel Loved and Please.

But what exactly went wrong - they ran out of time making the album? It was rushed?

I LOVE "Do You Feel Loved?", "Mofo", and "Please", though the single version has a great guitar solo and is better in most respects. The rest of the album just doesn't have the melodies, I think, even if the production was the last time the band actually tried to be bold. They should have worked another 6 months. Back then, the band was able to be more experimental with time and not succumb to commercialism, as it has since 2000. Without the creative failure of "Pop" the last 15 years could have been amazing!

At the same time, "Pop" has some worrying conservatism. "Staring at the Sun" is like an "Achtung Baby" b-side or close to it in quality. "Miami" has a great rhythm section, but The Edge was kinda lazy on this one. Ditto "Last Night on Earth" (though I really like Bono's rapping to that beat in the intro) and "Gone." The Edge messed up, folks.

In a way, U2 started to sell out with the "Batman Forever" single -- "Hold Me, Thrill Me, Kiss Me, Kill Me", which I still dislike.

 

[jeevey]

. The bass line is arguably Adam's best, the vocal is spectacular, Edge's guitar tone...how the fuck did he come up with that?

I actually listened to that song for quite a while before I realized that that even was a guitar.

In a way, U2 started to sell out with

The next time I hear somebody tell us exactly when U2 sold out I'm going to choke.

 

[elevated_u2_fan]

Mother...am I still your son
You know I've waited for so long to hear you say so
Mother...you left and made me someone
Now I'm still a child, no one tells me no

Looking for a sound that's going to drown out the world
(Been around the back...been around the front) Looking for the father of my two little girls
(Been around the back...been around the front) Got the swing got the sway got my straw in lemonade
(Been around the back...been around the front) Still looking for the face I had before the world was made
These are my favourite lines Bono has ever written, gives me chills every time I hear them.

 

[gvox]

Mother...am I still your son
You know I've waited for so long to hear you say so
Mother...you left and made me someone
Now I'm still a child, no one tells me no

Looking for a sound that's going to drown out the world
(Been around the back...been around the front) Looking for the father of my two little girls
(Been around the back...been around the front) Got the swing got the sway got my straw in lemonade
(Been around the back...been around the front) Still looking for the face I had before the world was made
These are my favourite lines Bono has ever written, gives me chills every time I hear them.

Very much agreed.

 

[gvox]

I was waiting for you to pop in on that.

Clever.

The next time I hear somebody tell us exactly when U2 sold out I'm going to choke them.

Fixed.

 

[gvox]

As for my thoughts on Pop, I honestly think it's a fairly brilliant album with some great songs, some of which I would definitely count among my favorite U2 tracks.

Do You Feel Loved - this should have been a single
Please
Mofo
Gone
Last Night On Earth
Discotheque
Playboy Mansion
If God Will Send His Angels


To a lesser extent..
Staring At the Sun
Wake Up Dead Man
If You Wear That Velvet Dress


aaaand in the U2 Wrote That?11!!?? category:

Miami

 

[Thrillhouse]

the "been around back" line i'll never hear as anything other than "lil red vette....lil red vette". i want to hear the been around lines but i just can't.

 

[chork]

Slag "Miami" all you want, but it's got the sex factor and that, as you may have noticed, works for me.

 

[chork]

The next time I hear somebody tell us exactly when U2 sold out I'm going to choke.

It was during UF--"...Coca-Cola, football, radio radio radio radio radio radio..."

...you ok, jeeves? Need a slap on the back?

 

[RoKKeR]

Man, Do You Feel Loved is just so damn good. Should have been a single, and it's too bad it didn't translate live very well. I can't find a very good live version, either.

How in the hell is Edge getting that super scratchy/wah tone at the breakdown at the beginning? It's so amazing, I can't get over it!

This thread has reignited my love for some of these songs. DYFL, Mofo, Gone, Please, I can't stop listening.

 

[corianderstem]

the "been around back" line i'll never hear as anything other than "lil red vette....lil red vette". i want to hear the been around lines but i just can't.

YES. My god, that used to drive me crazy. My mind was blown when I found out what the real words where.

 

[Nick66]

YES. My god, that used to drive me crazy. My mind was blown when I found out what the real words where.

Whoa...wait...he's not saying "lil red vette..."? I'm not taking the piss, I'm serious, I had no idea I heard that lyric wrong. Well damn.

Of course, I only listen to Pop once every 5 years at most, so there's that.

 

[Zoo Lemon]

Mofo is a clever, clever experiment. I'm led to believe it wasn't even born through a classic song writing style but rather adapting the lyrical ideas to an already conceived soundscape. If you have other details on the making of it, please share. And that scat singing (Mo-mother) on some lines is purely brilliant.

 

[Mountain Dew Ma]

Whoa...wait...he's not saying "lil red vette..."? I'm not taking the piss, I'm serious, I had no idea I heard that lyric wrong. Well damn.

Of course, I only listen to Pop once every 5 years at most, so there's that.

it's "been around front, been around back"

 

[chork]

Whoa...wait...he's not saying "lil red vette..."?

I anticipate that line will come with their midlife crisis album, due in April, apparently.

 

[Irvine511]

"White dopes on punk staring into the flash" is one of Bono's very best lines. Self-depreciating and self-aggrandizing and entirely accurate all at the same time.

 

[Mountain Dew Ma]

yeah basically everything about Mofo is awesome