Bono Interview in Rolling Stone

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What's happening is that people are starting to bring politics to the places they were not before. For people who have been fucked over by our political and economic system, politics have always been inescapable. And they're finally getting an opportunity, thanks to the proliferation of media outside the previously established structures, to get their voices heard and achieve some level of influence.



It's a wild time, but it's a net positive, because it's forcing people who would otherwise be able to put politics aside to reconcile that for many people, that is not an option. Allowing significant portions of society to be walled off, where politics should be avoided, isn't an option anymore. Because to continue on that way is to ignore all the suffering that is going on.



That may seem melodramatic to bring up in light of the subject matter of this conversation, but it's the broader point that needs to be beaten back against. Bono isn't going to suffer from this, but he is going to have to think. It's not mob mentality. It's trying to educate. He's 57 years old and has been rich for the majority of his life. He spends a lot of his time focused on certain things he's dedicated his life. Some things he's going to miss. Okay. Deal with it, learn from it, move on.



The point is, this isn't PC culture run amok, and it's not something we can roll our eyes at and ignore.



Makes sense to me, and hey, I’ll take being completely annoyed by it all of it means that something positive comes out of it.
 
What's happening is that people are starting to bring politics to the places they were not before. For people who have been fucked over by our political and economic system, politics have always been inescapable. And they're finally getting an opportunity, thanks to the proliferation of media outside the previously established structures, to get their voices heard and achieve some level of influence.

It's a wild time, but it's a net positive, because it's forcing people who would otherwise be able to put politics aside to reconcile that for many people, that is not an option. Allowing significant portions of society to be walled off, where politics should be avoided, isn't an option anymore. Because to continue on that way is to ignore all the suffering that is going on.

That may seem melodramatic to bring up in light of the subject matter of this conversation, but it's the broader point that needs to be beaten back against. Bono isn't going to suffer from this, but he is going to have to think. It's not mob mentality. It's trying to educate. He's 57 years old and has been rich for the majority of his life. He spends a lot of his time focused on certain things he's dedicated his life. Some things he's going to miss. Okay. Deal with it, learn from it, move on.

The point is, this isn't PC culture run amok, and it's not something we can roll our eyes at and ignore.

More hypocritical moralizing from someone who doesn't practice what he preaches. Take your rote garbage elsewhere.
 
Ah, that's some great moralizing there. You guys even beat out the religious right when it comes to that.

dude, I get where you are coming from on the over-sensitized PC angle, but quite frankly your calling people fascists is no better then when a bunch of these malcontented jackasses tried to claim that I was an excommunicated former Interference poster and a member of the alt-right, simply because I posted a few opinions they did not like. Those were ridiculous things to say, and whether you realize it or not you're doing the same thing. My sincere advice is that you should quit while you're behind.
 
Makes sense to me, and hey, I’ll take being completely annoyed by it all of it means that something positive comes out of it.
As a friend of mine who is a woman of color said to me, "Even if you're not personally guilty of it, you more than likely know people who are. And it's being cognizant of that, and knowing that as uncomfortable as it may be that you need to tell people in your life when they're doing it, that is the real thing you need to understand."

It's taken me a while to get to this point. I now see many of the same things I resent about right wingers happening with centrist liberals, albeit in slightly different ways.
 
As a friend of mine who is a woman of color said to me, "Even if you're not personally guilty of it, you more than likely know people who are. And it's being cognizant of that, and knowing that as uncomfortable as it may be that you need to tell people in your life when they're doing it, that is the real thing you need to understand."



It's taken me a while to get to this point. I now see many of the same things I resent about right wingers happening with centrist liberals, albeit in slightly different ways.



I hear that. I have an African American nephew. Truly African as he came from Ethiopia. My dad is a liberal. Loves his African American grandchild, yet made a racist comment without even realizing it. Shows that it’s all about educating each other. There are years and years of prejudice that gets engraved in us.
 
As a friend of mine who is a woman of color said to me, "Even if you're not personally guilty of it, you more than likely know people who are. And it's being cognizant of that, and knowing that as uncomfortable as it may be that you need to tell people in your life when they're doing it, that is the real thing you need to understand."

It's taken me a while to get to this point. I now see many of the same things I resent about right wingers happening with centrist liberals, albeit in slightly different ways.

It's astonishing that you can't see the problem when the people claiming to be offended and seeking to shut down the speech of others are the same people that get to decide what is offensive and what is not. You are so far down the self-hating, moralizing rabbit hole on this topic that I can't take anything you say seriously.
 
It's astonishing that you can't see the problem when the people claiming to be offended and seeking to shut down the speech of others are the same people that get to decide what is offensive and what is not. You are so far down the self-hating, moralizing rabbit hole on this topic that I can't take anything you say seriously.
Are you talking about having opinions? Because that's called having an opinion. They're not a government body trying to silence free speech. As far as I know, the only instance of that this year was the prosecution of the J20 protestors.

Are you for banning opinions in which someone casts judgment on someone else for what they said?
 
dude, I get where you are coming from on the over-sensitized PC angle, but quite frankly your calling people fascists is no better then when a bunch of these malcontented jackasses tried to claim that I was an excommunicated former Interference poster and a member of the alt-right, simply because I posted a few opinions they did not like. Those were ridiculous things to say, and whether you realize it or not you're doing the same thing. My sincere advice is that you should quit while you're behind.

Exactly. You can't complain about the left misusing and abusing terms like fascist and NAZI (and it happens here ALL the time) and use them yourself so sloppily.

Fascist is what we call people because it's the worst thing we can think to call someone. But it's almost always used incorrectly.
 
Let me know when you start treating people as people first, rather than just a collection of superficial characteristics first.
I can only judge you based on what you have said in this thread, since I don't know you. I bear you no ill will. I do bear ill will towards many of the things you said. I do not like them, and I think people holding those opinions need to break out of their echo chambers and have the types of conversations we are having.

My political views are very different from the ones I held even a few years ago. This isn't poorly thought out. I'm not hitching onto some fad because I'm mad about the results of one election. If you can't see that, frankly, that's on you. If I'm curt with you, it's because I find your viewpoints exhausting and out of tune with reality.
 
There are years and years of prejudice that gets engraved in us.



Which is why Bono deserves to be called up on this one.

I’ve done and said a lot of shit stuff in my time, but like Peef and unlike a certain poisonous fuckwit posting in this thread, I don’t cry bloody murder when I get called out any more - I try and educate myself and be better, like you said Mikal, so that we can all live in a society where EVERYONE feels comfortable and valued.
 
Which is why Bono deserves to be called up on this one.

I’ve done and said a lot of shit stuff in my time, but like Peef and unlike a certain poisonous fuckwit posting in this thread, I don’t cry bloody murder when I get called out any more - I try and educate myself and be better, like you said Mikal, so that we can all live in a society where EVERYONE feels comfortable and valued.



Yeah and I think the debate can also be over how much Bono should be called out, and it also makes sense to look at each individual’s history. So in the grand scheme of things, he’ll probably get more grief on this than he truly deserves but oh well.

And I agree with everything else you said.
 
Bono will certainly get more grief than he deserves.

But Bono is insulated, and has a hug amount of goodwill built up, and will be fine. If someone who owned a donut shop or hair salon said something like this, the social media mob would have seen to it that they were destroyed.
 
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I can only judge you based on what you have said in this thread, since I don't know you. I bear you no ill will. I do bear ill will towards many of the things you said. I do not like them, and I think people holding those opinions need to break out of their echo chambers and have the types of conversations we are having.

My political views are very different from the ones I held even a few years ago. This isn't poorly thought out. I'm not hitching onto some fad because I'm mad about the results of one election. If you can't see that, frankly, that's on you. If I'm curt with you, it's because I find your viewpoints exhausting and out of tune with reality.

Really? Because your virulently anti-cop posts and complete misrepresentation of what happened in Ferguson a few years ago make it seem like you have EXACTLY the same viewpoints now as you did a few years ago. Down-the-line, check-the-box, radical leftist garbage.
 
Really? Because your virulently anti-cop posts and complete misrepresentation of what happened in Ferguson a few years ago make it seem like you have EXACTLY the same viewpoints now as you did a few years ago. Down-the-line, check-the-box, radical leftist garbage.
Ahhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh, so your opinion of me is because you're an alter of an old poster who doesn't like my politics. We're done here.
 
Ahhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh, so your opinion of me is because you're an alter of an old poster who doesn't like my politics. We're done here.

Nope, not an alter. I lurked and read for years and just officially joined this year. I just remember how grossly wrong you and several others were when it came to that event, and how you (and others) never had the integrity to admit that you were wrong, or that you had effectively slandered a bunch of people.
 
Pity is, this stupid girly thing is overshadowing what is otherwise a really fantastic interview with Bono, he's in top form. And actually has been this entire promo tour.

Honest question for people much more hip on new music than I am...setting aside his perhaps poor choice of words, does he have a point about "rage" music for young men being primarily limited to hip hop, and there being a lack of the kind of outlet for angry young men via music?

Bono came up on punk, so I can see from his POV today's music may lack a certain...what? Anger? Rage? Muscularity? So is rock really less angry and rage fuelled than it used to be?

And in any event, isn't Bono's comment a bit of the pot calling the kettle black?
 
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Pity is, this stupid girly thing is overshadowing what is otherwise a really fantastic interview with Bono, he's in top form. And actually has been this entire promo tour.

Honest question for people much more hip on new music than I am...setting aside his perhaps poor choice of words, does he have a point about "rage" music for young men being primarily limited to hip hop, and there being a lack of the kind of outlet for angry young men via music?

Bono came up on punk, so I can see from his POV today's music may lack a certain...what? Anger? Rage? Muscularity? So is rock really less angry and rage fuelled than it used to be?

And in any event, isn't Bono's comment a bit of the pot calling the kettle black?

Yes! Good point, he's always thought they were angrier and more "punk rock" than they actually were/are.
 
And now is the time we back off the insult hurling, dredging up old political grievances, and in general making this thread about your issues with other posters.

Haywa, you seem unusually eager to cast your own judgments around at people who you claim to be outraged at for casting their judgment on others. You should take Iggy’s advice.
 
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Bono could have chooses his words a little more better.

Frankly I’ve never been impressed by the way he comes across in magazine interviews though.
 
Honest question for people much more hip on new music than I am...setting aside his perhaps poor choice of words, does he have a point about "rage" music for young men being primarily limited to hip hop, and there being a lack of the kind of outlet for angry young men via music?

Bono came up on punk, so I can see from his POV today's music may lack a certain...what? Anger? Rage? Muscularity? So is rock really less angry and rage fuelled than it used to be?

And in any event, isn't Bono's comment a bit of the pot calling the kettle black?

Depends what you're looking for. If you mean young men expressing anger in toxic ways, then yes there are fewer avenues to do that than a few decades ago, and rightly so.

But for young men whose anger isn't that of a shithead? Hell no. Obviously hip hop is a huge outlet - and Bono's comment implying it's not really for young white dudes is very strange, given all the white dudes rapping or at hip hop shows.

Metal is, of course, thriving across the planet. And the genres birthed from punk are big, especially metalcore and its derivatives, but also hardcore and post-hardcore. Emo has experienced a big resurgence in recent years; maybe there's a stereotype that's for sad young guys but it's also a good scene to channel anger in a healthy way. And if you've got some real bleak social alienation you don't have to go far to find a noise scene, and the misogynistic or racist noise artists of old are increasingly being confined to a narrow corner.

Of course each genre has problems with meathead fuckwits. In my experience those are usually regional scenes rather than genre scenes (so that a death metal scene in one city might be pretty healthy, but in another will feel threatening if you're not one of the boys). But there's plenty of effort being made so that everybody feels able to express themselves and their emotions without pushing out others who just want to have fun with a bit of musical catharsis.

And, to be honest, a lot of the angry young dudes who two decades ago you'd have seen at nu-metal shows or wearing a Limp Bizkit shirt, they now seem to be thrashing around at EDM festivals in shitty singlets.
 
Metal is, of course, thriving across the planet. And the genres birthed from punk are big, especially metalcore and its derivatives, but also hardcore and post-hardcore.

:up:

my daughter's (and son's) current band is deathcore, and my son is also a drummer in a technical death metal band (with a label), and both also play metalcore, hardcore and punk (and also reggae) - they're a sibling rhythm section hehe
 
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